SOVIETS vs Yuri

[Tommy]

Soviets Vs yuri? Impossible! Soviets can never win Yuri easily! Can anyone help devise a strtegy in countering yuri with Soviets? Apoclypse and flak tracks are useless against masterminds and gattling tanks combine. kirov airships? They are worthless against a group of gattlings. Is there anyway to blow Yuri's base????? USING Siege chopters? tHat will take time............ not a fast - paced game.

[starscream007]

It is possible. Practice makes perfect

[Statalyzer]

Be Iraq and use desos. They are the hardest thing for Yuri to counter, especially early on. Never build apocs. Mostly you use your desos out in front of your main force for protection, or you can deso-bomb him IF he doesn't have mind control units in his army yet.

However, there's something else nice you can do. Yuri players often pay very little attention to their miners. They move to ore on their own w/o stretching, and they gather the closest ore w/o needing micro. So, get a few desos in a flak track and take it over to near his miners, and unload. The desos will can take out his slaves from out of range of the miner. So, for at least a few seconds, you'll be hurting his money supply a lot.

[truefeel]

Soviets Vs yuri? Impossible! Soviets can never win Yuri easily! Can anyone help devise a strtegy in countering yuri with Soviets? Apoclypse and flak tracks are useless against masterminds and gattling tanks combine. kirov airships? They are worthless against a group of gattlings. Is there anyway to blow Yuri's base????? USING Siege chopters? tHat will take time............ not a fast - paced game.

Only strategy that works:

Get the potential tech buildings fast. yuri is slow on scouting and less able to protect his engies. Send dogs and eat his engies.
once you get WF, make 2-3 miners and right after that, only 5-6 terror drones. Also make radar asap, for desos. the desos are the key. Go agressive with them. deploy them near the slave miners to kill the slaves. use them to kill magnetrons/lashers/gatt tanks. use terror drones on chaos drones. While you've done this all, you have teched up very fast. Once you get BL, make flak tracks; you need them vs. floating disks (=the deso killer). Also make straight an Iron Curtain. Keep making drones/flak tracks/desos untill the IC is ready. Then IC 9 drones and drone his army. Do this several times until he's weakened enough. Then make tanks and finish the job.

What it comes down that you need to go agressive midgame so that he's slow on teching up and that you keep doing that until he manages to get the first floating disk. From there off, you will most likely have to camp it out.You will have to outmicro him to win.

[Tommy]

Only strategy that works:

Get the potential tech buildings fast. yuri is slow on scouting and less able to protect his engies. Send dogs and eat his engies.
once you get WF, make 2-3 miners and right after that, only 5-6 terror drones. Also make radar asap, for desos. the desos are the key. Go agressive with them. deploy them near the slave miners to kill the slaves. use them to kill magnetrons/lashers/gatt tanks. use terror drones on chaos drones. While you've done this all, you have teched up very fast. Once you get BL, make flak tracks; you need them vs. floating disks (=the deso killer). Also make straight an Iron Curtain. Keep making drones/flak tracks/desos untill the IC is ready. Then IC 9 drones and drone his army. Do this several times until he's weakened enough. Then make tanks and finish the job.

What it comes down that you need to go agressive midgame so that he's slow on teching up and that you keep doing that until he manages to get the first floating disk. From there off, you will most likely have to camp it out.You will have to outmicro him to win.

I have seen a lot of yuri players tech up faster than soviets and spam masterminds, gattlings and virus together. In late games, soviet have to bunker up badly, otherwise yuri can easily outrun soviet defences. Soviet long-range are lousy, only the V3 rocket..

I tried spamming siege chopters, similar to spamming rocketeers, but it takes quite a long time finishing a yuri base with the chopters. 20< siege is an awesome force.

I quite like your tactic using terror drones:) , but what about base invasion tactics?

[Statalyzer]

Since you're teched up anyway, Seiges are good for base invasion tactics. Especially if he has a lot of mind-control units, brutes, mags, etc, but fewer gatts. Remove gatts with IC-drones and then use the Choppers.

[SgtRicko]

Beh, siege choppers guns are too weak to be of any real use. Stick to V3s and terror drones: they make for excellent harrasment and (sometimes) siege units.

[truefeel]

I have seen a lot of yuri players tech up faster than soviets and spam masterminds, gattlings and virus together. In late games, soviet have to bunker up badly, otherwise yuri can easily outrun soviet defences. Soviet long-range are lousy, only the V3 rocket..

I tried spamming siege chopters, similar to spamming rocketeers, but it takes quite a long time finishing a yuri base with the chopters. 20< siege is an awesome force.

I quite like your tactic using terror drones:) , but what about base invasion tactics?

That's why you need to tech up faster. You have an advantage: yuri needs to make tanks right from the begin off. you can build miners instead and some desos. That way, you have no tanks. no tanks means more money, and that means fast teching up. If you can hurt his economy with the desos, you have slowed his teching up. Just watch on your desos that you don't need to replace them much.

don't bother making siege chopper; gatt tank. destroys them.
Magnetrons makes deployed siege choppersd useless.

There are no really base invasion tactics. You need to destroy yuri with IC, or, if you really managed to damage him that bad midgame, with desos his force and then you might consider making rhinoes. There's no other option; yuri's forces are too strong.

[Tommy]

That's why you need to tech up faster. You have an advantage: yuri needs to make tanks right from the begin off. you can build miners instead and some desos. That way, you have no tanks. no tanks means more money, and that means fast teching up. If you can hurt his economy with the desos, you have slowed his teching up. Just watch on your desos that you don't need to replace them much.

don't bother making siege chopper; gatt tank. destroys them.
Magnetrons makes deployed siege choppersd useless.

There are no really base invasion tactics. You need to destroy yuri with IC, or, if you really managed to damage him that bad midgame, with desos his force and then you might consider making rhinoes. There's no other option; yuri's forces are too strong.

What's an IC? Rhinos are good,but still yuri can outrun your forces easily. Seiege chopters are good for attacking, without deploying. A group of them are similar to the rocketeers tactic. You are right about gattlings, still can manage to hunt siege down.

[truefeel]

What's an IC? Rhinos are good,but still yuri can outrun your forces easily. Seiege chopters are good for attacking, without deploying. A group of them are similar to the rocketeers tactic. You are right about gattlings, still can manage to hunt siege down.

IC=Iron Curtain.

[Tommy]

IC=Iron Curtain.

My bad.That's why you need to tech up faster. You have an advantage: yuri needs to make tanks right from the begin off. you can build miners instead and some desos. That way, you have no tanks. no tanks means more money, and that means fast teching up. If you can hurt his economy with the desos, you have slowed his teching up. Just watch on your desos that you don't need to replace them much.

don't bother making siege chopper; gatt tank. destroys them.
Magnetrons makes deployed siege choppersd useless.

There are no really base invasion tactics. You need to destroy yuri with IC, or, if you really managed to damage him that bad midgame, with desos his force and then you might consider making rhinoes. There's no other option; yuri's forces are too strong.

Wouldn't that make Yuri imbalanced in late games?

[truefeel]

Wouldn't that make Yuri imbalanced in late games?

yuri=overpowered. Only weapon that soviet has is the Iron Curtain. And even with it, it's sadly still very difficult to win vs. a very good yuri player, b/c one time IC is not good enough. The chance the you aren't able to use your IC more then one time or not at all, is high enough.

[Statalyzer]

My bad.

Wouldn't that make Yuri imbalanced in late games?

Yes, it would. And he's not just imbalanced in late games either.

[Tommy]

Yes, it would. And he's not just imbalanced in late games either.

That realli suks.:redface:

[SgtRicko]

There's one small little thing Yuri sorta sucks at doing, and that is destroying walls. Only the brutes, Boomers, and lasher tanks can do that task efficiently.

Not too sure as how to employ that little tibit into an effective strategy, though: here's to hoping that somebody here can cook up something...:freek:

[Mercenary]

r0flcopter, to make truefeels post short, desos to kill slaves and units, drones for chaos drone, flak to kil disks, and iron will do the rest.

you should iron drones an send em, or better yet make a huge force and iron the beggining troops, master will not ctrl, and iron troops will kill.:wave:

[Tommy]

r0flcopter, to make truefeels post short, desos to kill slaves and units, drones for chaos drone, flak to kil disks, and iron will do the rest.

you should iron drones an send em, or better yet make a huge force and iron the beggining troops, master will not ctrl, and iron troops will kill.:wave:


But in general............ Yuri is still unbeatable. He is overpowered. I think the Soviets should have cosmonaults in skirmish and online games, that will balance up all three forces.IC=Iron Curtain.

Is there any way to destroy Yuri without the use of the iron curtain and nuke missle?
:redface:

[truefeel]

No. Btw, building nuke missile would be a waste of money. don't do it.

[SgtRicko]

But in general............ Yuri is still unbeatable. He is overpowered. I think the Soviets should have cosmonaults in skirmish and online games, that will balance up all three forces.

If you were to add in Cosmonauts, then the Allied rocketeers would be crap, and anything that is airborne and slow (i.e. Kirovs, siege choppers, Blackhawks, etc.) would be screwed as well.

[Mercenary]

But in general............ Yuri is still unbeatable. He is overpowered. I think the Soviets should have cosmonaults in skirmish and online games, that will balance up all three forces.

Is there any way to destroy Yuri without the use of the iron curtain and nuke missle?
:redface:

You are dead wrong, Yuri is a tough opponent. he is beatable sometimes<(^^<) No doubt, he has messed up yr the game single handily.

Thats why in most games, Hosts say no Yuri. And no cosmos are useless. Have you not seen what gats do to rockies????? They shred them into litttle pieces. What sovs need, is a non- mind controlable Tank.

Other than supers, It is impossible to beat yuri, even using desos, because of disks. But if the opponent is a noob, you can sometimes win.

it deopends on the map, alot of money = bad. yuri can make alot includong disks.

But i once beat a good yuri player in Dune Patrol, i made 5 rhinos and rushed. knowing that he prabaly had a psi-tower ready, i just killed his miners, boom, Economy scr3wed.

[truefeel]

Thats why in most games, Hosts say no Yuri. And no cosmos are useless. Have you not seen what gats do to rockies????? They shred them into litttle pieces. What sovs need, is a non- mind controlable Tank.


No; magnetrons own tanks. What soviet need is some sort of very long range mobile artillery with splash damage, that fire shells (not missiles).

[Mercenary]

No; magnetrons own tanks. What soviet need is some sort of very long range mobile artillery with splash damage, that fire shells (not missiles).


also like prisms, when promoted <(^^<).

but yea, i hate magnas, they bother my numbering when attaking.:color1:

[Tommy]

No; magnetrons own tanks. What soviet need is some sort of very long range mobile artillery with splash damage, that fire shells (not missiles).

Actually, I think the robot tank should be given to the soviets. Allied doesn't need it anyways.

[truefeel]

magnetrons also own robot tanks

[Mercenary]

magnetrons also own robot tanks

Agreed, with Gats and magans teaming up + robos weak armor, Magnas > robo.

[truefeel]

*bump to get active posts back ontop*

[ccaddictplayer]

Soviets Vs yuri? Impossible! Soviets can never win Yuri easily! Can anyone help devise a strtegy in countering yuri with Soviets? Apoclypse and flak tracks are useless against masterminds and gattling tanks combine. kirov airships? They are worthless against a group of gattlings. Is there anyway to blow Yuri's base????? USING Siege chopters? tHat will take time............ not a fast - paced game.

use boris against yuri clone and yuriprime he is immune to psychic
you can use terror drone against mastermind and chaos drone while have assistant of siegechopper v3 launcher for base w/ apocalypse etc. tank. and dreadnought w/ typoon submarine. protect your base with flak trak and circle w/ bunker + tesla coil.

I preferred to attack in devastation. I create 10 apocalypse 30 kirov 15 v3 launcher 20 terror drone 25 rhino tank i bought boris and 10 flak trak for base defenses circle of bunker w/ conscript inside. 10 dreadnought 5 squid 10 typoon submarine and +tesla trooper and siege chopper

I protect the base and then when nuclear missile is ready
lauch it first and use vulnerable to tanks and attack in all.
No mastermind can survive and YURI bases.

I love to attack in that hard rather than america which very easy to defeat enemy and no excitement

[truefeel]

Not going to work. drones and boris get owned by gatt tanks. Apocs by magnetron-mastemrind comibantion. V3s by gatt tanks. Siege choppers by gatt tanks-magnetrons. You see, it's easy to counter a unit, but it isn't to counter a mix of several types of units. And yuri has the best mix.

Dreadnought ?? lol, if it's a naval game, then the only tactic is pressing "quit". boomer rush own frickin hard in about 3 minutes gametime. There's nothing that can stop it. If you tell a noob exactly how to boomer rush and you let him fight the rank 1 soviet online player, that noob will win.

Only thing that can be thread are ICed drones, Iced rhinoes or desos (midgame). Desos b/c they are so versatile: there isn't really a midgame unit which can kill it without getting killed. ICed drones and ICed rhinoes: well, it says by itself, they are ICed and invulnerable. ICed drones are for killing yuri units, ICed.

And no; america is not easy to beat, when used right.


I preferred to attack in devastation. I create 10 apocalypse 30 kirov 15 v3 launcher 20 terror drone 25 rhino tank i bought boris and 10 flak trak for base defenses circle of bunker w/ conscript inside. 10 dreadnought 5 squid 10 typoon submarine and +tesla trooper and siege chopper


very rubbish. It's not only easy to beat, but you will also never be able to get those units. The longer the game last late game, the more yuri is in the advantage.

[Veteranewbie]

I'm glad I'm not the only one that have the same issue with Soviet against Yuri... it's a pity that the designers never attempt to patch it at least letting Soviet to stand a chance. To me, they should have made Yuri the unplayable race just like the Nagas in Warcraft III, anyway....

In which case, I guess that Siege Chopper is suppose to be an equivalent weapon as to Allied Prism Tank. This weapon has potential along with Terror Drone to be the Yuri killers. But it seems to me that, in reality, this weapon is simply a frustrating replacement of V3.

Terror Drone itself, unlike the robot tank, is of little general value. It doesn't have gun so their only purpose is to kill vehicles, yet they're vulnerable in every way. They don't function well in frontal assault, thus making them only go well in harassing miners, yet not much use against Yuri with their mobile gunned miners. A droned vehicle takes time to die, generally enough time for it to move to your vehicle to deliver and take a few hits. When destroyed under gunfire your drone goes with it, so it basically makes Terror Drone a limited suicide bomber.

In my opinion, it may be better to make siege chopper deploys faster (though honestly I think the idea of a siege chopper is ridiculous, they should just have a long range Air-Against-Surface-Missles Chopper instead so they can hack landvehicle to pieces), and let terror drone to disable a vehicle weapon when it attacks i.e. a Mastermind wouldn't be able to mind control with a TD in it (as well as disabling your own unit AI to attack a droned vehicle). Just my two cents.

If you ask me now how to win when playing Soviet against Yuri, I have no idea.

[Veteranewbie]

No; magnetrons own tanks. What soviet need is some sort of very long range mobile artillery with splash damage, that fire shells (not missiles).

I suppose siege chopper is to fulfil this job, but it doesn't work well enough

[truefeel]

Magnetrons outrange siege choppers. If you deploy those, I could lift them up andkill them with gatt tanks.

[Daishi]

I've seen a Yuri on Sedona Pass get his whole base creamed by a four IC Siege Choppers on a cliff, so the magnetrons were a bit too low to do anything. If you can pull it off, ownage.

[truefeel]

IC is a deadly weapon vs. yuri. But IC doesn't mean yuri has lost.

[Veteranewbie]

I have a hard time killing Yuri even when just playing against AI. I know, I know, the AI just turtle and send some tiny attack forces every few minutes. The frustration comes from the siege of a Yuri base. Siege Chopper is inefficient while the V3 rockets get shot down by gattling cannon in his base. And every now and then the computer send in some mastermind, yuri clones, virus, initiates, lasher and gattling tanks to disrupte my force. Since I tend to play a 3 v 3 game, whenever I take a siege on one Yuri (completely build up, let's assume 30mins in game), the others just come from behind. The problem lies here - it takes too long to take out the Yuri base.
The frustration doesn't end here. While my reinforcement (because eventually I lost a substantial of them) has to cross half way cross the map just to be mind-controlled or killed by some randomly scattered Yuri troops. Even when using Kirov I lost a substantial of them before a Yuri base can be taken out (but I deliberately not to use them, since I want to test the Soviet land forces against Yuri)
Anyway the result is horrific, I end up have to use a combine forces of Kirov, Dreadnought and land units to wipe out the three Yuris.
I have no problem using Allies, just choke in a handful of Robot tanks, grizzlies, IFVs, and most importantly, prisms, I can take out any Yuris AI anyday. Prism can kill mag and soldiers (yuri clone/ yuri/ brutes/ virus etc) and gatt tank (take out gat tank from far range is such a good idea), robot against mastermind, ifv against air, grizzlies and robot against lashers.
BTW I don't like superweapon hence I turn it off. So no IC for me (if I turn it on it's screwed anyway, since approaching a Yuri base is such a pain, it's a simply no no for me to take them out before they launch)
Are there any good strat to kill YUri with land forces (and doesn't involve IC)?

[Teron]

Are there any good strat to kill YUri with land forces (and doesn't involve IC)?

IC is pretty much THE Soviet weapon against Yuri. The other useful thing are Desos. It's been long since I last played, but IIRC if you don't have Desos, you're dead. Doesn't matter if it's Yuri or if it's Allies.

[Daishi]

Rhino spam works if you know what ur doing.

When against Yuri as soviets, try apocalypses + desos in mix.

And try tesla trax if ur floating cash and he's not expecting it. That's when you fill 5 tesla troopers in a flak track and uinload at close range while ur main force advances.

[truefeel]

Rhino spam works if you know what ur doing.

When against Yuri as soviets, try apocalypses + desos in mix.

And try tesla trax if ur floating cash and he's not expecting it. That's when you fill 5 tesla troopers in a flak track and uinload at close range while ur main force advances.

Rhinoe spam doesn't works. if he sees you doing that, he'll make masterminds. Same for deso+apocs: they get MCed on save range.

tesla tracks are not such a bad idea when the opponents doesn't has magnetrons, so for very early game. Could work, but forget about when he has magnetrons+gatt tanks. Then it will fail.

[Daishi]

Check this thread out. (http://forums.cncden.com/showthread.php?t=15643)

Best way for soviet: Harrasing yuri forces with Desolators (go radar before WF!) and terror drones while teching up (don't bother to make many rhino tanks; you should make them until for harrasing his miners until he gets magnetron). While teching up, make enough flak tracks. You will need them cause once yuri is teched up, he will use floating disks. When you're teched up, make an Iron Curtain. Wait until it's loaded up and then use it on 9 drones. Send those drones to his most expensive units: the magnetrons and his masterminds.

[truefeel]

Ah yes. And I said that the yuri player will use floating disks. I forgot to say on what: he uses them on desos. Same goes for masterminds: he will use those on desos. Desolators are very good vs. yuri when yuri doesn't posses a battle lab. But when he has it and is able to get masterminds and/or floating disks, you can't do anything with desos when he uses his masterminds/disks very well.

And for the rest, it comes exactly togehter with that quoted text of mine: rhinoes are not worth to build against yuri; only when ICed close to the yuri base. Apocs are in this case even worse: no fire on the move, less speed then rhinoes, less in number then rhinoes.

[Veteranewbie]

Haha, remind me of the good ol' time when I didn't realize how powerful Yuri is against Soviet. 20 apol rush into his base, big mistake, and that's when I learn my lesson.

[Daishi]

20 Apoc rush owns crap out of the AI's Psychic defense, but they don't go massing masterminds in response, now, do they?

[truefeel]

20 Apoc rush owns crap out of the AI's Psychic defense, but they don't go massing masterminds in response, now, do they?


You can't base yourself on the AI. AI in RA2/YR happens to be very stupid to use units the right way.

And you don't need to mass masterminds (not even possible). 5 masterminds can be the death for 100 apocs if you use them right;) .

[SgtRicko]

You can't base yourself on the AI. AI in RA2/YR happens to be very stupid to use units the right way.

And you don't need to mass masterminds (not even possible). 5 masterminds can be the death for 100 apocs if you use them right;) .

No,they'd end up overloading before you could do anything about it...

[truefeel]

read again:

And you don't need to mass masterminds (not even possible). 5 masterminds can be the death for 100 apocs if you use them right;) .

That means constantly hit 'n run. MC some apocs, run, MC some apocs run. The MCed and the other apocs end up killing eachother and there's nothing you can do about it, as apocs are too slow.

[Veteranewbie]

Hell, I would just put a grinder in the front of the base, and have 5 masterminds stay close to it.
100 apo will be no problem.

[Tommy]

Hell, I would just put a grinder in the front of the base, and have 5 masterminds stay close to it.
100 apo will be no problem.

Yuri is overpowered. Ask EA Games to fix the Soviets properly, so that it's own par with the Allied and Yuri :)

In the meantime...to defeat Yuri, just Use IC.

Or Spam Siege choppers and start rushing the yuri's base blowing every power and AA guns. Just watch out for Gattlings, floating disc.
Don't need to deploy siege and shoot, Just attack from the sky... it's like the same concept as the rocketeers spam Ah Haha:hyper: :hyper: .......... but you will lose great amount of men:x . But what can we do?

[Daishi]

Yuri is overpowered. Ask EA Games to fix the Soviets properly, so that it's own par with the Allied and Yuri :)

In the meantime...to defeat Yuri, just Use IC.

Or Spam Siege choppers and start rushing the yuri's base blowing every power and AA guns. Just watch out for Gattlings, floating disc.
Don't need to deploy siege and shoot, Just attack from the sky... it's like the same concept as the rocketeers spam Ah Haha:hyper: :hyper: .......... but you will lose great amount of men:x . But what can we do?

****, dude, EVERY yuri noob will have more gattlers than they need. Skilled Yuris will rip that strat to shreds with a standard gatts + lashers. Siege choppers are only good in combination with the IC on certain maps IF HE ISN'T PREPARED. Don't forget the Yuri's AA is the best AA in the game.

But what can we do?

Terror Drones, desolators, Rhinos and flak tracks, in combination with the Iron Curtain.

[truefeel]

lashers+gatt tanks cannot defeat siege choppers. gatt tanks + magnetrons do.

remember that you can only use rhinoes in combination with the IC. Using rhinoes without the IC is only in your disadvantage.

In the meantime...to defeat Yuri, just Use IC.

You make it sound simple, but is not;) . A good yuri player will kick the crap out of you before you can use the IC. Even if you can use it, you'll need to do it multiple times.

Or Spam Siege choppers and start rushing the yuri's base blowing every power and AA guns. Just watch out for Gattlings, floating disc.

That's the problem: a yuri player will have those+ magnetrons. if you deploy, you will loose alot of siege choppers, due that magnetrons outrange siege choppers. If you lift siege choppers in the air, they can't fire and are very vulnerable to gatt tanks. Undeployed siege choppers can do hit 'n run, but you'll do very few damage, b/c you will be constantly on the run for gatt tanks.

Don't need to deploy siege and shoot, Just attack from the sky... it's like the same concept as the rocketeers spam Ah Haha:hyper: :hyper: .......... but you will lose great amount of men:x . But what can we do?

kill slaves with desos so he will tech up slow, while you tech up fast for IC. And you'll need to tech up fast, alot faster then the yuri player.

[kissmebye]

You can't base yourself on the AI. AI in RA2/YR happens to be very stupid to use units the right way.

And you don't need to mass masterminds (not even possible). 5 masterminds can be the death for 100 apocs if you use them right;) .

to beat Yuri, build a lot of rhino tanks, and use the fodders (about 20?). When the masterminds come to control your rhino tanks, move your fodders to the masterminds to control them and the tanks will be overpowered. Then use your tanks to attack mastermind tanks when they are overpowered.

YES, it is possible to OWN Yuri with the cute Soviet if you play well and think before you do anything :)
Remember, anything is possible...

[Daishi]

All fodder except for hanging miners get shredded by gatts. Even after it gets MCed.

[truefeel]

to beat Yuri, build a lot of rhino tanks, and use the fodders (about 20?). When the masterminds come to control your rhino tanks, move your fodders to the masterminds to control them and the tanks will be overpowered. Then use your tanks to attack mastermind tanks when they are overpowered.

YES, it is possible to OWN Yuri with the cute Soviet if you play well and think before you do anything :)
Remember, anything is possible...

rubbish tactic. If I do MC your fodder, it turns to your disadvantage (you will shoot at your own fodder instead my uints). Yes, most yuri players just go in with their masterminds and do not actually have tank control. But do agree with this: yuri players with tank control and who micro masterminds, will leave the masterminds relatively at the level of 4 MCed units/a masterminds. Some other yuri player will prefer to do first hit 'n run with gatt tanks to take out fodder. And then the most yuri players will just go in with everything they got. Do remember that even the less good yuri players will use magnetrons.

I'm gonna repeat myself: it's not every single unit of yuri apart, but it's the mix of all those yuri units TOGETHER. one unit fills up the other ones weakness. That's where most people go wrong when they play a yuri opponent: they are thinking only on countering single units and not the whole mix. When you are Iraq, you need to use a totally different strategy vs. yuri then in SvS or AvS wars, where all sov. players are just brainless spamming rhinoes, following the principle "ugh ugh, me have more tanks, ugh ugh me win".

[Statalyzer]

to beat Yuri, build a lot of rhino tanks, and use the fodders (about 20?). When the masterminds come to control your rhino tanks, move your fodders to the masterminds to control them and the tanks will be overpowered. Then use your tanks to attack mastermind tanks when they are overpowered.

If I'm Yuri in that scenario I won't even build masterminds. A few Gatts chew up the fodder, and Lashers, Brutes, and Magnetrons combine to destroy the rhinos.

[kissmebye]

rubbish tactic. If I do MC your fodder, it turns to your disadvantage (you will shoot at your own fodder instead my uints). Yes, most yuri players just go in with their masterminds and do not actually have tank control. But do agree with this: yuri players with tank control and who micro masterminds, will leave the masterminds relatively at the level of 4 MCed units/a masterminds. Some other yuri player will prefer to do first hit 'n run with gatt tanks to take out fodder. And then the most yuri players will just go in with everything they got. Do remember that even the less good yuri players will use magnetrons.

I'm gonna repeat myself: it's not every single unit of yuri apart, but it's the mix of all those yuri units TOGETHER. one unit fills up the other ones weakness. That's where most people go wrong when they play a yuri opponent: they are thinking only on countering single units and not the whole mix. When you are Iraq, you need to use a totally different strategy vs. yuri then in SvS or AvS wars, where all sov. players are just brainless spamming rhinoes, following the principle &quot;ugh ugh, me have more tanks, ugh ugh me win&quot;.

Yes you may shoot your own fodders but just move rhinos behind yuri or somewhere away from fodders and attack yuri, yuri will have no more MC to control. Yes the gatt tanks may kill the fodders to stop the overpower on MC but you have time to kill the MC and when the fodders are gone, they will have no more MC to control. And for Magz, they can kill rhinos easily- but use the flak wiv desos in and you rule :) Thats true, gatt tanks can kill desos fast but they will be busy, shooting at rhinos and you have a chance to deploy your own desos FAST.

[truefeel]

Yes you may shoot your own fodders but just move rhinos behind yuri or somewhere away from fodders and attack yuri, yuri will have no more MC to control. Yes the gatt tanks may kill the fodders to stop the overpower on MC but you have time to kill the MC and when the fodders are gone, they will have no more MC to control. And for Magz, they can kill rhinos easily- but use the flak wiv desos in and you rule :) Thats true, gatt tanks can kill desos fast but they will be busy, shooting at rhinos and you have a chance to deploy your own desos FAST.

Then you have 2 groups of units: one with infantry (which aren't fodder anymore) and the rhinoes. It's speaking for itself that I will concentrate on the rhinoes and IGNORING the fodder. You don't have time either, b/c I'm buying myself time with magnetrons. and desos in flak tracks is not good either for the same reason: magnetrons.

I can show it if you want. I'm not a yuri player and I can guarantee you are not able to win with rhinoes+fodder vs. yuri. And I odn't say that b/c I have a thick neck, but b/c it's just how the game is.

If I'm Yuri in that scenario I won't even build masterminds. A few Gatts chew up the fodder, and Lashers, Brutes, and Magnetrons combine to destroy the rhinos.

Yeah, that's true. You don't even need masterminds. Magnetrons do the job. That's why you can't make rhinoes: They'll get lifted up, which makes that you are fighting a few rhinoes at a time with 7-9 lashers, for example. And then you even don't need to attack directly; magnetrons have 12 cells range, enough to lift up rhinoes, to keep lashers in front of magnetrons and stay out of range of fodder.

[Teron]

And, if it gets really desperate, you have Viruses to take out some of the infantry before they get to the Gatts. Hell, a Drone or two might work, too.

[truefeel]

Mostly, you will not need them. Except when he's pushing with desos midgame, then you need to use chaos drones.

[Daishi]

whoa, chaos drones have a use!

[truefeel]

chaossed deployed desos undeploy and can't be deployed again until the chaos effect has faded away, making desos very vulnerable to gatt tanks. Chaos drones are radation immune, so it's save to bring them near deployed desos. The chaos drone has a weak point though: it can be droned by terror drones.

[Teron]

XD
Didn't know that. Or that.
Nice to know they're actually good for something.

[Tommy]

it's quite easy...

Soviets just need to defend the iron curtain. Without the iron curtain is also easy.... just hit ALT + F4 or just plug out the computer to get an instant 'win'...:scared:

Screw Yuri... he messed up everything :gnarly:

[truefeel]

it's quite easy...

Soviets just need to defend the iron curtain. Without the iron curtain is also easy.... just hit ALT + F4 or just plug out the computer to get an instant 'win'...:scared:

Screw Yuri... he messed up everything :gnarly:

Then I'll do my aftermatch pwn: report into the cheat-report section at xwis forums:p

[Tommy]

Ah haha:color3:
Probably the most famous cheat in C&C history..:gnarly:

[Volken45]

Hate to burst your bubble but.. un plugging a comp cant be proven AT ALL i have power outages all the time... so uhh if u report someone for "Cheating" with the OHH WAHHHH!!! i was winning they shut off there PC Waahhhh Crap ur gambling cuz if it was a power outage or a Dc ur gonna get in trubble urself...

[truefeel]

Hate to burst your bubble but.. un plugging a comp cant be proven AT ALL i have power outages all the time... so uhh if u report someone for "Cheating" with the OHH WAHHHH!!! i was winning they shut off there PC Waahhhh Crap ur gambling cuz if it was a power outage or a Dc ur gonna get in trubble urself...

Haha, it can. With taking screenshots. Also: the game stats are saved on the server and can be recalled any time. On those game stats are presented who had how many kills, how many bought and so on. With those game stats, which show the obvious winner, and the screenshot of the reconnection error (and that error is what I'll get when you unplug your pc; you see: reconnection errors are NEVER coinsedence), you'll get banned:p .

[Mercenary]

a key thing for me to be able to beat yuri was to make sure his economy wasnt very good. as said before use early desolators to radiate his slave killing them. then try to make quick rhino tanks to make hit and run assaults on his mieners eventually taking some out. usually if he doesnt camp aka bunkering up with magnetrons and pscyhic control you can kill him with an all out rhino/deso attack. also to stop yuri super weapons and master minds try taking out his battle lab in a sneak attack.

If it is a camping game which most yuri players camp, try making quick iron curtain. dont waste ur cash on making IC'ed drones, instead iron curtain 9 rhino tanks to kill his essential buildings. heres a priority list.

1-Super weapons
2-war factory to stop him from making master minds
3-con yard to stop another super weapon or war fac
4-barracks
5-battle lab

[ALaRm2202]

your first priority to killing yuri with iron curtained tanks are the following(with explanation)

1. Battlelab(so he can not use forceshield or is forced to use it)
2.conyard(so he cant build)
3. meatgrinder (if he has one so he cant build con back up)
4. SW (if any)
5. Warfac

its also effective to have different tanks shooting different things i. e.
2 tanks can kill battlelab while 7 shoot con.

Make him use that forceshield!

[Statalyzer]

If I'd already killed Yuri's Conyard and Grinder, I'd go for his WF before I go for a SW. If he can't build vehicles he will lose even if he's got SWs. Example: 1 Kirov = autowin unless he already has a buttload of Gatt Towers all over his base (and no good player will have that many defenses up).

its also effective to have different tanks shooting different things i. e.
2 tanks can kill battlelab while 7 shoot con

That's one of the 2 biggest mistakes I see people make with IC tanks (including myself sometimes), is always using the tanks to hit the same building.

[ALaRm2202]

If I'd already killed Yuri's Conyard and Grinder, I'd go for his WF before I go for a SW. If he can't build vehicles he will lose even if he's got SWs. Example: 1 Kirov = autowin unless he already has a buttload of Gatt Towers all over his base (and no good player will have that many defenses up).



That's one of the 2 biggest mistakes I see people make with IC tanks (including myself sometimes), is always using the tanks to hit the same building.

its true to go for the warfactory, but most likely in a long game to get sw yuri usually has 2+ warfacs. if he only has one then yes i agree ^^ but with 2 id rather go for sw and deso spam

[Statalyzer]

but most likely in a long game to get sw yuri usually has 2+ warfacs

That's a good point.

[sg500]

Back when i was playing i had a little success vs yuri using the oddest combos and on non-water maps i quit the game before i refined the stratedgy.normally a good yuri would have 2-3 gatts,a few lashers and 1 brute a 4-6 mags a mastermind the rest saucers with a prime.Im not saying this stratedgy will win all the time but i had good results by using the sovs cheapest units.It was no longer a battle of tc but more like micromanagement.id start flacks and drones a few conscripst then mass deso.Sounds simple but the key is the fodder.Yes u will lose units to mags but economy wise id rather lose a drone or flack than a rhyno.in my games it always came down to the disks vs my desoes.they mag my flacks id come deso. the mags retreat they'd come disks.Its like some virtual dance.

[Daishi]

Sounds like fun. But yeah, you're not going to get far righting a mind-control/focused-firepower faction with expensive units, naturally it'll be all about the Rhinos, flaks (sometimes w/infantry), drones, and subs to counter everything he's got.

I wouldn't recommend any infantry moving without vehicles because of how hard it would be to make them effective. Better to use IFVs and BFs, or suicide a flak track in to get as close as possible to the enemy.

[truefeel]

Even rhinoes shouldn't be overused against yuri. Mainly drones and desos are the key. ICed drones are a very hard weapon against yuri. his best bet is grinding the droned vehicles and that's it.

[jo_2]

Who said siege choppers werent useful? Maybe not for everything, but a squad of them are handy for taking out a soon to be activated Mutator/Dominator. Ok Let's face it, your opponent is either a little careless with defence or outright stupid. But against AI, this one sucks.

[truefeel]

lol, that's a serious bump.

Well, do remind though that deployed siege choppers are very vulnerable when lifted up by magnetrons; also remind that a yuri player who sees you make siege choppers will make gatt tanks.

This topic was made and discussed with assuming the opponent as a human player, not an AI.

[Lyserg33]

LOL.... if i play as soviets normally IC is THE best weapon against yuri, maybe ICed apocalypse tanks hidden on your base would be ok....< use when near the opponent cuz if its too far away then IC would be dispersed......

[jo_2]

lol, that's a serious bump.

Well, do remind though that deployed siege choppers are very vulnerable when lifted up by magnetrons; also remind that a yuri player who sees you make siege choppers will make gatt tanks.

This topic was made and discussed with assuming the opponent as a human player, not an AI.

I am with you here truefeel. That tactic wouldn't be so easy to pull of against a human opponent. But yes if you can count on the iron curtain.

[truefeel]

That counts for everything. You are better of ICing 9 drones and wreck havoc with that.

[jo_2]

9 IC'd drones, or 90, won't do much good against a superweapon or other structure, don't you think?

Yes of course, the IC applies to everything. I am aware of that...

[truefeel]

You don't see it. If you IC 9 drones, you can attack his units. Each droned unit is death for sure, and if he does not grind the droned unit in time, the drones will get to other units aswell. so 9+ units are dead, which could leave you a way to his base to destroy that superweapon.

[jo_2]

You don't see it. If you IC 9 drones, you can attack his units. Each droned unit is death for sure, and if he does not grind the droned unit in time, the drones will get to other units aswell. so 9+ units are dead, which could leave you a way to his base to destroy that superweapon.

Granted... IF he depends on units for most of his defenses. If he depends on gattling cannons/Bunker/Psy towers, those drones aint much help.

[truefeel]

A good player never depends on static defences. Units are far better in defending then static defences ever can be. If he depends on static defences, you can just take control of the whole map.

[jo_2]

A good player never depends on static defences. Units are far better in defending then static defences ever can be. If he depends on static defences, you can just take control of the whole map.

Ok, but units have their weaknesses, just as we have been commenting. RA2 yuri prime or drones make short work of most units, but not of static defences. Having at least some static defences can mean the difference between holding him off or defeat if a IC drone attack is followed up by another type of assault.

PS I know I'm a persistent, stubborn hardhead...

[truefeel]

You say that the RA2 yuri prime does not make short work of static defences, but that unit actually does, indirect. It's easy to mind control the appropiate unit. If you don't have any units, it's easy: your opponent will either hunt your miners down begin game or will later in the game just send a few units who outrange defences. As you don't have any units, you can't take out the threat.

I'm not saying that static defences are useless. In some emergency cases they can make the difference, but if you rely on units, e.g. for soviets only rhino tanks; you have both defensive capabilities and offensive capabilities, which are both mobile. Dynamic defences can cover most of your weak points, including miners. Static defences cannot, for example, be built inside an ore field.

It's ok to debate on that. You don't have to, and you should not, take everything I say for granted. My problem is though lag of time to put in this. I'd like to show it to you how it is really played. It is not a challenge or something like that, just a method to decrease the required time to give you a clear idea how I see it and optionally, enough to convince you of the general concept of how RA2/YR are being played online.

[jo_2]

You say that the RA2 yuri prime does not make short work of static defences, but that unit actually does, indirect. It's easy to mind control the appropiate unit. If you don't have any units, it's easy: your opponent will either hunt your miners down begin game or will later in the game just send a few units who outrange defences. As you don't have any units, you can't take out the threat.

I'm not saying that static defences are useless. In some emergency cases they can make the difference, but if you rely on units, e.g. for soviets only rhino tanks; you have both defensive capabilities and offensive capabilities, which are both mobile. Dynamic defences can cover most of your weak points, including miners. Static defences cannot, for example, be built inside an ore field.

It's ok to debate on that. You don't have to, and you should not, take everything I say for granted. My problem is though lag of time to put in this. I'd like to show it to you how it is really played. It is not a challenge or something like that, just a method to decrease the required time to give you a clear idea how I see it and optionally, enough to convince you of the general concept of how RA2/YR are being played online.

Thanks truefeel for your latest post. I gather what you are driving at about the importance of units. But I did not mean not having ANY units dedicated to defence. I meant a combination of both static defences and units. Because the units are vulnerable to drones and yuri prime, at least if they are wiped out you still have something left to defend your base with (though its not a very good idea to let him live long enough to wipe out ALL your units).
Actually, what I do in most games for anti air defense is, rather than build patriots or Flak cannons or gatt cannons, I construct 5-10 IFVs/flak tracks/gatt tanks and move them as a group wherever they are most needed, e.g towards an incoming kirov airship.

Thanks very much for the invitiation, I am honoured that a veteran would offer to share his wisdom and experience in such a practical way. However,
I lack time too... quite busy with real life as well... and I guess you'd win anyway...the first rounds...:evil:

cheers to all

[truefeel]

Thanks very much for the invitiation, I am honoured that a veteran would offer to share his wisdom and experience in such a practical way. However,
I lack time too... quite busy with real life as well... and I guess you'd win anyway...the first rounds...:evil:It's not about winning; just to show you what I exactly mean. That can mean more then a thousand worths. Neither does it have to take long; 30 minutes would be enough.

Actually, what I do in most games for anti air defense is, rather than build patriots or Flak cannons or gatt cannons, I construct 5-10 IFVs/flak tracks/gatt tanks and move them as a group wherever they are most needed, e.g towards an incoming kirov airship.Not only your quantities are far too much, you also assume the opponent makes aircraft, which he could just as well not do. React on what your opponent does and not on what he does not.

[jo_2]

Not only your quantities are far too much, you also assume the opponent makes aircraft, which he could just as well not do.

In multiplayer games, as I'm sure you know, it's not uncommon for a soviet opponent to send in 15+ siege choppers at you if he has been left unchecked long enough to crank em out and send them at you. I'd say 5-10 AA vehicles are not too little, they are too few.

React on what your opponent does and not on what he does not.

Point taken. Thanks

Cheers

[truefeel]

In multiplayer games, as I'm sure you know, it's not uncommon for a soviet opponent to send in 15+ siege choppers at you if he has been left unchecked long enough to crank em out and send them at you. I'd say 5-10 AA vehicles are not too little, they are too few.that tactic is barely used, as most maps are too open. On some maps, especially sedona and hidden valley, 5 of them can be really usefull, but 15 of them are too much. A tip though, if he makes choppers, make some choppers yourself, alongside flak tracks of course. Use your choppers to destroy his deployed choppers, else you'll have problem to destroy siege choppers on the cliffs.

Also note that you need to need to know which AA units are good for which air units and which are not good. I'll try to summarise it for you:

-GGI BFs are very good against all none-organic units, decent against masses of none-organic units but very bad against organic air units (rocketeers).
-IFVs: good against none-organic air units, bad against masses of them, decent against organic air units
-Rocketeers: good against none-organic air units (if there are multiple rocketeers), good against masses of air units, very good against organic air units. Also note there is some sort of trick to let rocketeers fire on the move, but quite difficult to master.
-GGIs: decent against none-organic air units, average against masses of them, very bad against organic air units. note: GGIs function far better in BFs.

-Flak tracks: decent against none-organic air units, excellent against masses of them and also excellent against organic air units
-apocs: average against none-organic units, bad against masses of them and also bad against none-organic.
-siege choppers: average against none-organic air units, average against masses of them and decent against organic units

-gatt tanks: excellent against none-organic air units, decent against masses and excellent against organic air units. Especially good b/c it can fire on the move.
-floating disks: decent against none-organic air, average to decent against masses and good against air units. can also fire on the move.

Overall, AA missiles are the worst b/c that units all tent fire on the first unit coming in their range, instead of spreading the fire over multiple units, and also take the longest to travel to the target. GGI BFs are a bit of an exception due it combines 5 GGIs with fire on the move and armour, making it effective against planes and such. Flak makes up with splash damage, making you need less of flak tracks then allieds need IFVs. Gatt tanks make up with being the best cost-effective AA. Gatt tanks are also the only basic AA ground units that fire on the move and also have more armour. Normally, you would only need 1 black eagle missile to destroy a flak track or an IFV, while you actually need a bit more then that to take a gatt tank.

So overall, gatt tanks are the most cost-effective AA units, but with a close second to flak tracks.

[apple23]

May I also add that missiles of any kind are very bad in this game, because if the target is moving (especially away from the missile) it is almost gauraunteed to miss the target completely, same thing happens with air targets, but not as often. Another disadvantage with missiles is that if you have alot of them and the target is destroyed, all the missiles en route to the already destroyed target are useless, meaning that alot of firepower and time is wasted.

[truefeel]

Yeh, well said Apple. I forgot about that.

[Statalyzer]

Don't forget some maps have lakes and the best AA unit in the game is the Aegis Cruiser.

[truefeel]

Yeh, but most maps are only land or have land enough to go around.

[GettinGwap]

Don't forget some maps have lakes and the best AA unit in the game is the Aegis Cruiser.

Not to say your point isn't valid, but i like sea scorpion better simply because it builds faster/cheaper, moves faster, and has splash damage. I completely agree that the cruiser is awesome, but i prefer sea scorpion. besides it can attack targets on shores.:p

[truefeel]

Piscinex ones said it is a flak cannon on a speedboat. I can't deny he was right.

[apple23]

Just to verify that, yes, it uses the exact same weapon as a flak cannon. Only difference is that it is on a speedboat.

And also, I disagre that the aegis is the best AA unit. It may be the most powerful, but that doesn't make it the best. It's dreadfully slow, where aircraft are generally much faster and its versatility is very limited because of the simple fact that it can only cross water. Plus the fact that it is one of the only mobile AA units that cannot attack ground/cannot defend itself at all against terrestrial threats.

[truefeel]

sea scorpions are very good against against ospreys. Combine 1 or 2 with subs and destroyers cannot fight subs.

[apple23]

The allies have alternatives -Dolphin spam-, But good point nonteheless.

[truefeel]

Your point about dolphins is valid, but I was talking about mid game, not late game.

[apple23]

Dolphins come fast if the allied player knows what he is doing. If he tech up ASAP, his first dolphins can come early-mid game, though for the most part full-on dolphin spam usually doesn't come until later.

[truefeel]

well, early, mid and late game don't actually have anything to do with time. It just points at the (overall) stage players are. So one player can be in midgame, while the other can be in early game. My point overall was that flak boats (forgot the name) and subs pwn destroyers. Of course, dolphins are a different matter.

[GettinGwap]

well, early, mid and late game don't actually have anything to do with time. It just points at the (overall) stage players are. So one player can be in midgame, while the other can be in early game. My point overall was that flak boats (forgot the name) and subs pwn destroyers. Of course, dolphins are a different matter.

They're call sea scorpions. Cool name if i must say

[apple23]

Oh, I get ya... and funny how you forgot the name when you could have looked up about 4 posts to one of your own posts... :p

[truefeel]

I have not played YR in a while, so it's all a bit fussy now :).

[apple23]

but you said the name yourself in an earlier post, and used it appropriately. I can't imagine you forgot it in 2 days, but I guess anything can happen to us old farts :p.

[truefeel]

Guess I have alzheimer light :D.

[apple23]

anyways, back on subject, yes, destroyers are helpless against subs and scorpions comdined. Now... where were we?

[truefeel]

We were arguing about wether doplhins should be put in the equation or not :p.

But let's just take subs+sea scorps against destroyers. Me and Daishi runned some test a long time ago, with some interesting results and strategies: just sub+scorps obvious pwn destroyers, but daishi took it a bit further by targeting the scorps with his destroyers. Eventually we came back to the conclusion that scorps+subs pwn destroyers, providing the soviet player micromanages enough to evade the destroyers yet be efficient enough to bring the ospreys down. However, if we put bring in micromanagment into a scenario subs without scorps vs. destroyers, destroyers have the upperhand, if you do hit 'n run, providing the subs keep chasing the destroyers.

There's also a manner to prevent dolphins hitting multiple subs at the same time, by lining subs up diagonal. YR90 found that trick, but Daishi and me came to the conclusion it's not practical enough in practice, as it would take too much time to line them up. A quick attempt though might be helpfull to reduce the effect of dolphins.

[Statalyzer]

My guess is that would only be mildly helpful, since any sub manuevering into position would also be passing up opportunities to fire.

[truefeel]

Dunno how good subs really are against dolphins. Can 1 sub kill 2 dolphins ?

[apple23]

That depends. The closer the dolphin is to its target, the more damage it does. In other words, if the dolphin is right next to the sub, the sub might lose to just 1 (just a theory, haven't tested yet), but from afar, dolphins do much less damage (because the wave travels faster when from afar, much slower when closer up) so a sub may be able to take on 2.

[truefeel]

Dunno if the games mechanic are that complicated :p. From what I see, we are still talking about simple warheads which do the damage in the intented cell.

[apple23]

Yes, the sonics mechanic is that complicated. The sonic wave does its AmbientDamage at some interval of time (Very short; like each frame it applies more damage) to everything that it is touching at that time. In other words, the longer that the wave is touching a single object, the more damage it does.

Now, consider that the wave travels faster when the dolphin is further away from its target and slower when it is closer to its target. When it travels slower, it is touching the target for a longer amount of time, and therefore, it does more damage. This is the same logic applies to shipyards, and why it does more damage when you fire all the way through the yard (like force fire at the other end of it), because it goes through all the cells, and in the end, is on the shipyard for longer.

[truefeel]

Hmmm, I always toughed it was only b/c the warhead hitted 4 cells instead of 1. Didn't knew that it also had to do with the speed of the warhead. Ok, so the dolphins need to be close. Not a real problem b/c dolphins are way faster then subs (in turning and speed).

Thumbs up, apple. That's information which is very useable :).

[apple23]

it's actually a bit of both; Warheads and buildings are finicky in this game. I am sure you're familiar with the CellSpread logic with buildings. If a warhead has a cellspread of 1, that means it will damage the cell it hits and all of the cells around it, In the end that is 9 Cells (1 in the middle and 8 surrounding it). Now IF there was no PercentAtMax on the warhead, this would do 9 Times its normal damage to a 3x3 or larger building. PercentAtMax limits this, and usually CellSpread isn't as large as 1, usually 0.3 or 0.5, but anyways, here's the relevance to sonic weapons:

In most cases, you don't have it perfectly lined up where the wave only goes over one row of cells, so the wave will end up at some points going over 2 or even more cells of the shipyard at once. Now as of right now, this is still a theory, but evidence suggests that if the wave is traveling over 2 or more cells at once it will Multiply its ambient damage by however many cells it is traveling over. So if it is traveling over 3 cells at once, the dolphin's AmbientDamage of 4 will be multiplied by 3, making it 12, and for an AmbientDamage value, that is monstrous. That surpasses the ambient damage of an elite dolphin by almost 2 times.

[truefeel]

This should be tested out.

Lolz, we can easily make a paper of this: "the the effects of RA2 dolphins" :p.

[GettinGwap]

This should be tested out.

Lolz, we can easily make a paper of this: "the the effects of RA2 dolphins" :p.

I'm not trying to think of papers right now. The holidays always hit students hard here

[Ivan_Moscavich]

read again:



That means constantly hit 'n run. MC some apocs, run, MC some apocs run. The MCed and the other apocs end up killing eachother and there's nothing you can do about it, as apocs are too slow.

People always never take into account people that can micromanage tanks just as well as people can micromanage other units.

Here's an idea, I'll prove why you can't beat a hundred Apocalypse tanks with 5 masterminds and 5 magnatrons.

A: There would be multible groups, all of them would not be concentrated on one set, at five fronts you have 20 apocs against one mastermind and one magnetron.

B: You think by mind controling a few apocs it'll make the whole group stop and attack them? Wrong, force move control q, they will not only keep on going, ingnoring the mind controled apocs, but they will fire on the move thanks to the second command. (Yes it does work)

C: Once the apocs pass through or by the enemy forces, all fire is concentrated on relieving the mind controled and disabled apocs. After that it's smooth sailing.


I find it pitiful that people think they can stop a huge force of tanks because they just assume people send them out with no micromanaging experience whatso ever, many people do, but there are people like me that take pride in micromanaging huges groups of tanks.
I made my way to the top because I controled my tanks better than anyone else, you know how else? Because I broke through all known anti tank counters with superior micromanagement skills in large groups of tanks.

So before you go thinking any mass of units will be easily defeated, remember, there are people like me that specialize in large scale microing. People like this are few in number, but generaly uncounterable by standard and most special measures.

[truefeel]

People always never take into account people that can micromanage tanks just as well as people can micromanage other units.

Here's an idea, I'll prove why you can't beat a hundred Apocalypse tanks with 5 masterminds and 5 magnatrons.

Ok, that's true. BUT: 100 apocs against 5 masterminds isn't a realistic comparisation either. It's more like 100 apocs vs. 100 mastermkinds. And then you have a problem.


I find it pitiful that people think they can stop a huge force of tanks because they just assume people send them out with no micromanaging experience whatso ever, many people do, but there are people like me that take pride in micromanaging huges groups of tanks.
I made my way to the top because I controled my tanks better than anyone else, you know how else? Because I broke through all known anti tank counters with superior micromanagement skills in large groups of tanks.

You can win with micromanagement, but only if your micro is much better then the yuri player. Compare a noob player with a top player, the top player will always win (well most of the time anyway). You have to compare 2 players with the same skillz. What turns out ? yuri players win with equal or even less skill then the opposing player.

[Ivan_Moscavich]

Ok, that's true. BUT: 100 apocs against 5 masterminds isn't a realistic comparisation either. It's more like 100 apocs vs. 100 mastermkinds. And then you have a problem.



You can win with micromanagement, but only if your micro is much better then the yuri player. Compare a noob player with a top player, the top player will always win (well most of the time anyway). You have to compare 2 players with the same skillz. What turns out ? yuri players win with equal or even less skill then the opposing player.

However, this would be a stale mate, as magnetrons can not destroy units, just disable them.

[truefeel]

Ehhh ? I am talking about masterminds.

[Statalyzer]

The shipyard-destroying capacity of the dolphins shouldn't be overlooked when comparing them with subs.

If we have a battle between 10 subs and 20 dolphins, I'm probably going to peel away 2 dolphins and fight the battle 10v18, and my other 2 will take out the Soviet Naval Yard. Even if he's still building sub reinforcements, they probably won't be able to stop the dolphins b/c they can destroy the yard in literally just 2-3 seconds from when they first become revealed. And now I can reinforce my fleet with more dolphins and he can't reinforce with more subs.

[apple23]

combine that with what was earlier mentioned and you have a 500 dollar, very fast, ridiculously powerful, and extremely highly spammable unit that totally dominates over any other naval unit.


People always never take into account people that can micromanage tanks just as well as people can micromanage other units.

Here's an idea, I'll prove why you can't beat a hundred Apocalypse tanks with 5 masterminds and 5 magnatrons.

A: There would be multible groups, all of them would not be concentrated on one set, at five fronts you have 20 apocs against one mastermind and one magnetron.

B: You think by mind controling a few apocs it'll make the whole group stop and attack them? Wrong, force move control q, they will not only keep on going, ingnoring the mind controled apocs, but they will fire on the move thanks to the second command. (Yes it does work)

C: Once the apocs pass through or by the enemy forces, all fire is concentrated on relieving the mind controled and disabled apocs. After that it's smooth sailing.


I find it pitiful that people think they can stop a huge force of tanks because they just assume people send them out with no micromanaging experience whatso ever, many people do, but there are people like me that take pride in micromanaging huges groups of tanks.
I made my way to the top because I controled my tanks better than anyone else, you know how else? Because I broke through all known anti tank counters with superior micromanagement skills in large groups of tanks.

So before you go thinking any mass of units will be easily defeated, remember, there are people like me that specialize in large scale microing. People like this are few in number, but generaly uncounterable by standard and most special measures.


Do you have any idea how ridiculous it sounds that you boast superior tank control and micromanagement when simultaneously bragging about beating 5 masterminds with 100 apocs? Dude, a first timer could probably do that.

First off, it depends much on the terrain you are assaulting the mastermind at. If it is an open field (which is very rarely ever is) then of course 100 apocs would beat 5 masterminds. What idiot would lose that battle? Now if the path to assault was a bridge, there is no way possibly that a million and a half apocs could beat 5 masterminds, considering the most you could possibly send in a row is 3.

Now I know I went into the 2 extremes there, but the medium is still not hard enough for 100 apocs to lose to a mere 5 masterminds.

The other problem here is that those numbers are not only ridiculously huge, but horridly out of porportion. You would have to be facing a first timer to have a matchup of 100 apocs to 5 masterminds. If you are both thinking along the same lines, that will be 1 mastermind for every apoc, then you're in trouble BIGTIME, especially if the amount of tanks on each side is so ridiculously huge as 100.

Another problem that makes your scenario even more unrealistic is the fact that a half decent yuri player will almost never have just purely masterminds. The true power in Yuri's forces lies in the mix. Masterminds with Mags and Gatts vs apocs of equal or even up to 1.5 times greater value and the apocs are still ****ed, no questioning it.

[truefeel]

Meh, let him. He is one of those really old oldskool dudes; once he has his YR fixed, I'll show him how it is done ;).

[Ivan_Moscavich]

I know it was a exageration, but I was just giving a plain answer there. The truth is I have mutlible groups of units within groups.
Of course keep in mind I made my way to the top in RA2, not YR, never really cared much to play YR online much.

However I have played against yuri forces, and I have developed counters that stay true to my land based approach.

I look at the way people play now and am almost sad, it's nothing like it used to be. Maybe that's why i don't like playing online, everything is geared towards instant victory, not large scale battles that make the game not just fun to play, but fun to watch.

My mentality is, sure you can destroy a warfactory with four rhinos, but why? Why not destroy it with twelve rhinos and four apocs. The thing is I have, or rather had the skills to do that.

[truefeel]

When I got my main computer fixed, we'll see if we can do some games. I don't like it that we have not played yet, it looks like I'm trying to bail out, but my main compy is just a whack of **** now, together with the morons who tried to fix it.

[GettinGwap]

When I got my main computer fixed, we'll see if we can do some games. I don't like it that we have not played yet, it looks like I'm trying to bail out, but my main compy is just a whack of **** now, together with the morons who tried to fix it.

Yea, get that fixed. I got a score to settle. Lol but really I have improved.

[truefeel]

How many was the current standing ? 10-0 for me ? :p

[GettinGwap]

How many was the current standing ? 10-0 for me ? :p

I don't think we played that many. More like 5 or so. Yea, but I haven't won many. But I can't imagine many people beating you.

[Ivan_Moscavich]

I don't think we played that many. More like 5 or so. Yea, but I haven't won many. But I can't imagine many people beating you.

We'll just see about that.
If only I had some sort of time machine, I'd loved to have taken on a mouthy fellow like this in my prime, I'd show him what's what.

Still, even now I give him a 47% chance of victory against me.

[truefeel]

We'll see; leave the talk for when we do that game.

On the side note: my main computer is finally getting fixed. I had to go up and down to the pc shop 5 frickin times. The SOB of a pc seemly worked everytime when it got there but this time it luckily does not. Seems the motherboard is ****ed up.

[GettinGwap]

[quote=truefeel;396661]We'll see; leave the talk for when we do that game.

On the side note: my main computer is finally getting fixed.

Well, I've got a score to settle.

[apple23]

I don't think we played that many. More like 5 or so. Yea, but I haven't won many. But I can't imagine many people beating you.

I beat truefeel... once... out of 5 games... :p


I know it was a exageration, but I was just giving a plain answer there. The truth is I have mutlible groups of units within groups.
Of course keep in mind I made my way to the top in RA2, not YR, never really cared much to play YR online much.

However I have played against yuri forces, and I have developed counters that stay true to my land based approach.

I look at the way people play now and am almost sad, it's nothing like it used to be. Maybe that's why i don't like playing online, everything is geared towards instant victory, not large scale battles that make the game not just fun to play, but fun to watch.

My mentality is, sure you can destroy a warfactory with four rhinos, but why? Why not destroy it with twelve rhinos and four apocs. The thing is I have, or rather had the skills to do that.


Ivan, you seem to miss the reason i called you out on that one. The reason be is that you are coming off as obscenely arrogant talking about yourself like that, it's disgusting. This is especially bad when you admittedly don't have the skills to do what you say you could do, and you have yet to back yourself up at all on any of this. Your points hold no value because they are obvious or ridiculous.

Now the thing you said about short games; you see, the thing is, people like to win games. and they know they have a much better chance at winning if they rush fast and knock thier enemy out ASAP. It indeed has proven to be the best strategy that there is in RA2 online gameplay today.

You see, the longer the game lasts, the larger the tank forces get typically, unless the game is going back and forth with attacking (and I have played games like those... those are really epic, and REALLY fun).

The reason that hardly ever happens is because of people's obsession with 2v2 games, where it ALWAYS ends up being 2vs1 at some point. Another reason is because of noobs. You see, for really long and epic games to either last that long or be fun at all, everyone playing has to be of roughly equal skill level. Someone with vastly inferior skill will obviously lose quite quickly, either ending the game or making it very one sided. If the game does last a long time with the noob in it, then it is no fun because 2 players are spamming tanks like hell versus only one player who is spamming tanks.

The other reason that really long games aren't very fun is becuase of MASSIVE tank forces. 1) it creates lag, 2) that huge of a tank force thrown all at once at your enemy is hard to control effectively, and 3) why throw that much force when just some 10 tanks could do the job?

You see, the best, and most fun kind of game is a game where both players make small forces and then attack, rebuild and attack, rebuild and attack over and over. If both players know what they are doing, there will be lots of variety between each time they attack, and one player will slowly weaken until the final assault comes and finishes him, or he makes an epic comeback and wins or restarts the cycle.

If you have ever played a game like that, you would know how much fun it is.

[Ivan_Moscavich]

I beat truefeel... once... out of 5 games... :p



Ivan, you seem to miss the reason i called you out on that one. The reason be is that you are coming off as obscenely arrogant talking about yourself like that, it's disgusting. This is especially bad when you admittedly don't have the skills to do what you say you could do, and you have yet to back yourself up at all on any of this. Your points hold no value because they are obvious or ridiculous.

Now the thing you said about short games; you see, the thing is, people like to win games. and they know they have a much better chance at winning if they rush fast and knock thier enemy out ASAP. It indeed has proven to be the best strategy that there is in RA2 online gameplay today.

You see, the longer the game lasts, the larger the tank forces get typically, unless the game is going back and forth with attacking (and I have played games like those... those are really epic, and REALLY fun).

The reason that hardly ever happens is because of people's obsession with 2v2 games, where it ALWAYS ends up being 2vs1 at some point. Another reason is because of noobs. You see, for really long and epic games to either last that long or be fun at all, everyone playing has to be of roughly equal skill level. Someone with vastly inferior skill will obviously lose quite quickly, either ending the game or making it very one sided. If the game does last a long time with the noob in it, then it is no fun because 2 players are spamming tanks like hell versus only one player who is spamming tanks.

The other reason that really long games aren't very fun is becuase of MASSIVE tank forces. 1) it creates lag, 2) that huge of a tank force thrown all at once at your enemy is hard to control effectively, and 3) why throw that much force when just some 10 tanks could do the job?

You see, the best, and most fun kind of game is a game where both players make small forces and then attack, rebuild and attack, rebuild and attack over and over. If both players know what they are doing, there will be lots of variety between each time they attack, and one player will slowly weaken until the final assault comes and finishes him, or he makes an epic comeback and wins or restarts the cycle.

If you have ever played a game like that, you would know how much fun it is.

I see what you're saying, but I just don't look at it that way. If the westwood servers were up I could dig up my record. I don't make a habit of lying, and I don't lie about acievements. It would also help if I had some replays, but unfortunately I never made any, so you'll just have to take my word at it's value, which i try to have it remain high.

the kind of game I like is where you have massive battles, perhaps you took that as one massive battle. That is incorrect. Multible massive battles over time.
Now of course this doesn't happen all of the time. But I like to let the opponent build up there forces, and I do enjoy light skimrishes every once and a while.

I should start taking down names when I rarely get on these days on even RA3, when I encounter a new player, I always let them build up, i let them experience the taste of battle. I not only enjoy playing with newer players to help them along, but I just don't go to everyone i mean and brutaly crush them, what fun would that be? No, I make battles last long, so I can enjoy the game I'm playing.
Of course when i encounter a player at my skill level, goody, it's a fun time even more because I don't have to hold anything back.
Occasionaly I'll encounter someone way outside my skill range, in that case it's all out, hold on to the last square foot of ground, the last boot on the ground, the very last piece of steel. Those are the games I enjoy the most though, because even if I lose, I know I went at it with everything I had.

I try to adjust my skill level to who I'm playing, I like fairly even, largescale warfare. Wars are fought with small skirmishes, large skirmishes, and fullscale battles.
I must have given you the wrong impression, but allow me to clarify.
I am by no means incapable of building Rhinos, 4 flak tracks, and support infantry and sending them to the enemy base or to meet an enemy attack force.
What i strive for are those large battles.

You see when I played however, there were alot of people like me, people who also enjoyed large scale battles. Mutlible clashes of 50+ units over the course of the battle. Seemlessly managing all forces was what made it incredibly fun.

Anyways, to sum it up, I ackowlege bring myself forward as blunt and bombastic, but I'm not just a big talker, I have, or rather did have those skills when I played. But that's in the past, my examples are from the past. Admitedly I can't produce proof, because it is no longer avalible, I'm unable to find any of the old players I hung around with. really all I have is my memory and my word, which should be more than enough.
Today I'd probably be considered an above average player, but you missed me at my prime, sad to say.
You'll just have to get used to my personality, I don't mean to berate anyone or talk down to people, that's just how I speak.

[truefeel]

I see what you're saying, but I just don't look at it that way. If the westwood servers were up I could dig up my record. I don't make a habit of lying, and I don't lie about acievements. It would also help if I had some replays, but unfortunately I never made any, so you'll just have to take my word at it's value, which i try to have it remain high.lolz, westwood servers were full with maphackers and noobs. The real pro player were ALWAYS at xwis servers. And like I said before, keep the talk for the game. It has not much use now and as you see it infuriates Apple :p.

the kind of game I like is where you have massive battles, perhaps you took that as one massive battle. That is incorrect. Multible massive battles over time.
Now of course this doesn't happen all of the time. But I like to let the opponent build up there forces, and I do enjoy light skimrishes every once and a while.It completelly played the opposite way today. It's all about rushing, fast attacks, spltters, etc. Massive battles are more rare in 1v1 games.

Well, I forgot to mention btw: my main pc is broken, but this laptop (not build or bought for gaming, but anyway) could also handle RA2. We could do some games today, if you do the effort of reinstalling RA2.

I beat truefeel... once... out of 56758658658 games... :p

fixed :p

[Ivan_Moscavich]

>as you see it infuriates Apple :p.

Well that's his problem, not mine, I don't go out of my way to impress people or get them to like me, if they want to be my friend, it requires respect on both sides.

And I actualy almost never encountered and map hackers or cheaters. Say what you will about some of the morons on there, there were some fantastic people, excluding myself of course. My first best, and problably the only guy I knew that was consistently better than me (except on my custom extreme strategy maps, although since i made the map that kind of gave me an unfair advantage) in the games we played.

I'm actualy at work, but I'll contact you as soon as I have RA2 installed and ready to go.

Edit:
By the way, where'd Ricko give me a comment from? I'd like to give a return one but I don't see him in the thread, I'd like to at least reply from a thread rather than go to a random thread that is irrelevent to this thread and give one from there.

[truefeel]

Well that's his problem, not mine, I don't go out of my way to impress people or get them to like me, if they want to be my friend, it requires respect on both sides.

Exactly, and by saying "he only has 47 percent chance" you are not really showing respect. I can handle that perfectly, nor do I have problems with or do I take offense at it, but you have to consider you are making public messages so what you say, even if it was only directed at one person, is interpreted by alot of people. If you know Apple better, you'll notice he is actualy a friendly guy, as long you stay discrete and look out for your grammar (the latter one not being problem for you).

And I actualy almost never encountered and map hackers or cheaters. Say what you will about some of the morons on there, there were some fantastic people, excluding myself of course. My first best, and problably the only guy I knew that was consistently better than me (except on my custom extreme strategy maps, although since i made the map that kind of gave me an unfair advantage) in the games we played.

b/c if they maphack, chances are good you don't notice it (while maphacking clearly gives a significant advantage), also note that back in the imes of westwood, crates were on during QM and b/c the maphacker simply could tell he picked up a reveal map crate, it was impossible to prove it. I will not deny there were good players around those days, but did it not crossed your mind how many years that was ago? The manner of playing this game has evolved hugely and if you would put such an oldskool player back in this game these games, he would loose even to the less good players. I personally think though that the westwood top players were no match for the xwis top players.

[apple23]

I see what you're saying, but I just don't look at it that way. If the westwood servers were up I could dig up my record. I don't make a habit of lying, and I don't lie about acievements. It would also help if I had some replays, but unfortunately I never made any, so you'll just have to take my word at it's value, which i try to have it remain high.

I am not questioning your acheivements here. The thing is, with the way you talk, you give me nothing to convince me that you have even remenants of the skill you say you had.


the kind of game I like is where you have massive battles, perhaps you took that as one massive battle. That is incorrect. Multible massive battles over time.
Now of course this doesn't happen all of the time. But I like to let the opponent build up there forces, and I do enjoy light skimrishes every once and a while.

If the "perfect game" described in my earlier post roughly matches your visualization then perhaps I misunderstood you, and we now have understanding. If not, then my point remains.

I should start taking down names when I rarely get on these days on even RA3, when I encounter a new player, I always let them build up, i let them experience the taste of battle. I not only enjoy playing with newer players to help them along, but I just don't go to everyone i mean and brutaly crush them, what fun would that be? No, I make battles last long, so I can enjoy the game I'm playing.

Now it is one thing to go easy on a new player and help them out, that can be fun in its own way, but it doesn't make for a very exciting game does it?


Of course when i encounter a player at my skill level, goody, it's a fun time even more because I don't have to hold anything back.
Occasionaly I'll encounter someone way outside my skill range, in that case it's all out, hold on to the last square foot of ground, the last boot on the ground, the very last piece of steel. Those are the games I enjoy the most though, because even if I lose, I know I went at it with everything I had.


Games like those, I agree, are always fun.

I try to adjust my skill level to who I'm playing, I like fairly even, largescale warfare. Wars are fought with small skirmishes, large skirmishes, and fullscale battles.

but it is very circumstantial. In real war, other circumstances line up to allow for logn and epic battles and skirmishes, but in a fast paced RTS such as RA2, such circumstances are rare in general battle. This is especially true when you take into consideration how hugely the strategies on RA2 have evolved over the nearly 8 and a half years that this game has been out.


I must have given you the wrong impression, but allow me to clarify.
I am by no means incapable of building Rhinos, 4 flak tracks, and support infantry and sending them to the enemy base or to meet an enemy attack force.
What i strive for are those large battles.


Now I understand where you are comming from, but 1) good battles like those can only really take place under certain circumstances, and 2) like i said earlier the average player is concerned more with winning, because that's how they have fun. People have fun in different ways, you know.

Anyways, to sum it up, I ackowlege bring myself forward as blunt and bombastic, but I'm not just a big talker, I have, or rather did have those skills when I played. But that's in the past, my examples are from the past. Admitedly I can't produce proof, because it is no longer avalible, I'm unable to find any of the old players I hung around with. really all I have is my memory and my word, which should be more than enough.
Today I'd probably be considered an above average player, but you missed me at my prime, sad to say.
You'll just have to get used to my personality, I don't mean to berate anyone or talk down to people, that's just how I speak.

ugh, you once again completely missed the reason i called you out in the first place and continue to call you out on this crap. The thing is, you admittedly don't have as much skills as you say you had. All you have is your word, and especially the way you have been putting it, your word is very insubstantial. It proves nothing and holds little value. You say you were such a great player, you boast such great micromanagement skills, you say you had all this stuff, but in your stretegy talk, you say nothing to even hint that you ever had such skills.


Well that's his problem, not mine, I don't go out of my way to impress people or get them to like me, if they want to be my friend, it requires respect on both sides.

for reasons stated above, you have long yet to gain any real respect from me, just mutual agreement at best.

And I actualy almost never encountered and map hackers or cheaters. Say what you will about some of the morons on there, there were some fantastic people, excluding myself of course. My first best, and problably the only guy I knew that was consistently better than me (except on my custom extreme strategy maps, although since i made the map that kind of gave me an unfair advantage) in the games we played.

There is no doubt that there were great players in the past, but since there was virtually no support in westwood, lots of people took enjoyment out of cheating. LOTS of people.

[GettinGwap]

Looks like several people want to come out of retirement? I want to see a good fight hell, even participate.:devil:

[apple23]

umm... sure. If i'm not too busy playing the greatness that is RA3 (Which I bought yesterday).

[truefeel]

Ivan, I don't want to annoy you, but I tought we agreed to play yesterday. You did not came online on msn. Now you'll have to wait till the next weekend.

[Ivan_Moscavich]

Ivan, I don't want to annoy you, but I tought we agreed to play yesterday. You did not came online on msn. Now you'll have to wait till the next weekend.

I havn't got around to reinstalling RA2 yet, and infact I've been redoing the orignal CnC and RA missions from start to finish.

Apple, since you're online in RA3, I'd like to find you on there, for the time being I won't be able to fight anyone on RA2, but I'm on Ra3 every so often online.

If you see Ivan_Moscavich that's me, not very creative I know, but I'm not the creative type.

[truefeel]

I havn't got around to reinstalling RA2 yet, and infact I've been redoing the orignal CnC and RA missions from start to finish.

Well, could we arrange then something for next friday/saturday ? I want to round this up and RA2 does not take long to install and patch up anyway.
It could be 30 minutes well spend, if you can beat me :p.

[GettinGwap]

Well, could we arrange then something for next friday/saturday ? I want to round this up and RA2 does not take long to install and patch up anyway.
It could be 30 minutes well spend, if you can beat me :p.

What about me?:(

[truefeel]

What about me?:(

I'll see; I don't have alot of time. Maybe tommorow

[Ivan_Moscavich]

Well, could we arrange then something for next friday/saturday ? I want to round this up and RA2 does not take long to install and patch up anyway.
It could be 30 minutes well spend, if you can beat me :p.

I'll see if i have the time to spare sometime this week and reinstall it.

[truefeel]

Let me know something in time; I have other plans also.

[SirSnake]

In order to make a fine point I can say only this:


Spam snipers and IFVs!

If you dont get it; you dont get it.

Nb I hold no personal responsibility for any online (or otherwise) losses you may suffer following my advice!

[Daishi]

I tried it out and it actually works pretty well. I've never beaten Yuri as the soviets so easily until I started spamming snipers and IFVs.

[Ivan_Moscavich]

Wait, wait a minute...

Something is wrong here, but I just can't seem to put my finger on it.

I guess I might as well train some Soviet snipers and build some Soviet IFVs and try it out.

[GettinGwap]

Well, could we arrange then something for next friday/saturday ? I want to round this up and RA2 does not take long to install and patch up anyway.
It could be 30 minutes well spend, if you can beat me :p.

What time? Remember, our times zones are different. Friday(today) is good for me. I'm free almost all day.

[truefeel]

hmm, I was actually talking to Ivan, but IF I get my pc back today (depending if I can get transportation), we can arrange something.

You'll probably beat me :p. I haven't played in ages.

EDIT: yeh, baby, I got my monster back. I'll be installing some things and if YR wants to work, we can kick some ass !!

[GettinGwap]

we need some kind of better communication than this. is there another way to correspond with you otherr than msn?

[truefeel]

Well, maybe through email (mine is urlings_55@hotmail.com)


Gimme a reply if you want to play now.

[apple23]

In order to make a fine point I can say only this:


Spam snipers and IFVs!

If you dont get it; you dont get it.

Nb I hold no personal responsibility for any online (or otherwise) losses you may suffer following my advice!

Yeah... don't just read the title and reply. The subject has been massively overhauled since the creation of this thread.

Anyways, if Ivan ever gets his RA2 going, I want to play him also.

[Ivan_Moscavich]

Yeah... don't just read the title and reply. The subject has been massively overhauled since the creation of this thread.

Anyways, if Ivan ever gets his RA2 going, I want to play him also.

I just bought Sins of a solar empire to suplant Galactic civilization as my space strategy game, so, taking some of my RA time away.

[truefeel]

I just bought Sins of a solar empire to suplant Galactic civilization as my space strategy game, so, taking some of my RA time away.

Ah common, man. You have made a promise, so life to that first.

[Ivan_Moscavich]

Ah common, man. You have made a promise, so life to that first.

i promised I would play you, i gave no specific time frame for it to take place in.
however truthfully, I just havn't felt like playing cnc lately.

[GettinGwap]

i promised I would play you, i gave no specific time frame for it to take place in.
however truthfully, I just havn't felt like playing cnc lately.

Sounds like someone doesn't want to play anymore? Maybe he's just using the time to get refreshed for the game? Hell, I think I can beat him. I'll play you too. And Apple, why not you? May as well play with the best all at the same time.

[truefeel]

i promised I would play you, i gave no specific time frame for it to take place in.
however truthfully, I just havn't felt like playing cnc lately.

When you promise a small thing like this, it is normal it is done within a small timespan. I also think you have given that (a week ago on saturday you said you would do it in the next day. I went on msn for 3 hours, but you did not showed up). It's ok if something came up, but do realise then you morally are required to do it as soon as possible then.
If you don't want to, well, ithen it's ok for me, but alteast say that then instead of keeping posponing it. I don't really like that and especially not when people come with all these excuses.

Also remember why we would do this: it was for proof who's manner of play is the best. If you just walk away from this, after all the times you promised to play, it does not good to your credibility.

No offense though, you are a good guy, but you need to know I value high on promises. For me this is also ****ty, as I promised TO YOU also the same thing and now I can not forfill that. Again, if I am forcing you to do something against your will, then plz say it so that we can just call it off, but don't keep posponing it.

[YuriPrime]

Well first and foremost you should do everything you can to destroy yuri's miners. Seek and destroy my friend.

Secondly, spam flak traks since they are 375 bucks each once an IP is built. Send a huge swarm of them to yuri's psychic towers. (Remember they can only mind control 3 at a time!) With their mind control abilities occupied on your flak traks, send in your rhinos to destroy the towers.

Another thing you might try is to escort a large group of Kirovs to your opponent's base using flak traks and terror drones. Once there, reak some havoc!

[truefeel]

Secondly, spam flak traks since they are 375 bucks each once an IP is built. Send a huge swarm of them to yuri's psychic towers. (Remember they can only mind control 3 at a time!) With their mind control abilities occupied on your flak traks, send in your rhinos to destroy the towers.1. Flak tracks cost 500 bucks
2.conscripts are cheaper
3.He could just as well have a grinder and grind your flak tracks, giving him not only cash but also makes slots back open.
4. A yuri who knows the basics will not build more then 1-2 psychic towers in most games, good chance not even one.

Another thing you might try is to escort a large group of Kirovs to your opponent's base using flak traks and terror drones. Once there, reak some havoc!Kirovs cost 2000 a piece. 2 gattling tanks own perfectly one and would also win against flak tracks and terror drones (while flak tracks are better one on one then gattling tanks, flak tracks don't fire on the move, which gatt tanks). If I would trow in a few magnetrons also, I can defeat your mix of units with mine, while spending ALOT of cash less then you.

I suggest reading the complete topic before replying :).

[SirSnake]

Wait, wait a minute...

Something is wrong here, but I just can't seem to put my finger on it.

I guess I might as well train some Soviet snipers and build some Soviet IFVs and try it out.

Yeah... don't just read the title and reply. The subject has been massively overhauled since the creation of this thread.

Anyways, if Ivan ever gets his RA2 going, I want to play him also.


wow ****, you guys must have missed out on that whole "sense of humour" business in the womb?


Did you trade it in for "cutting replies" points instead? Cause I gotta tell you, you got duped! :rolleyes:

[Ivan_Moscavich]

wow ****, you guys must have missed out on that whole "sense of humour" business in the womb?


Did you trade it in for "cutting replies" points instead? Cause I gotta tell you, you got duped! :rolleyes:

I was trying to be genuinely funny.

[Ivan_Moscavich]

When you promise a small thing like this, it is normal it is done within a small timespan. I also think you have given that (a week ago on saturday you said you would do it in the next day. I went on msn for 3 hours, but you did not showed up). It's ok if something came up, but do realise then you morally are required to do it as soon as possible then.
If you don't want to, well, ithen it's ok for me, but alteast say that then instead of keeping posponing it. I don't really like that and especially not when people come with all these excuses.

Also remember why we would do this: it was for proof who's manner of play is the best. If you just walk away from this, after all the times you promised to play, it does not good to your credibility.

No offense though, you are a good guy, but you need to know I value high on promises. For me this is also ****ty, as I promised TO YOU also the same thing and now I can not forfill that. Again, if I am forcing you to do something against your will, then plz say it so that we can just call it off, but don't keep posponing it.

Alright look I'll reinstall it if I can this week. The snow has caused a major laspe in things so won't have anything to do the entire week. but if I get one more of those errors I'm saying **** it.
And I don't recall the fight being about who's style is best. You're comparing two styles from two different time frames with two different back grounds of people played the game.
My tactic rellies on there being large scale battles for prolonged warfare, yours is to build a few units, rush the enmy, and hope to strike a fatal blow. they are two completely different types of play. The thing is, if you don't beat me early game, you won't win. The longer the game goes the better i get by order of magnitude. The trick is going to be getting me in the early game.
I was under the impression that we were fighting so we could more adequetly explain each others tactics through battle rather than words.

If I get it reinstalled I'm up for the weekend, so any time then will be fine. But if that indeterminable error keeps popping up or it won't connect to the servers I'm calling it off. I won't waste time on something that's broken and can't be fixed.

You see what's bothering me is that it worked fine before, and now it's not. And there is absolutely no reason it should be not working correctly.
They only thing I've changed from the original set up is all the most current patches and that fan patch.
Adding another thing to the list, I'll either need to uninstall tha patch and reinstall it, or just re run it when I reinstall the specific games.

[SirSnake]

I was trying to be genuinely funny.


uh.... sorry then, :redface:


whoops thats me owned by irony! :lol:

[Statalyzer]

1. Flak tracks cost 500 bucks

He said with an industrial plant.

[YuriPrime]

1. Flak tracks cost 500 bucks
2.conscripts are cheaper
3.He could just as well have a grinder and grind your flak tracks, giving him not only cash but also makes slots back open.
4. A yuri who knows the basics will not build more then 1-2 psychic towers in most games, good chance not even one.

Kirovs cost 2000 a piece. 2 gattling tanks own perfectly one and would also win against flak tracks and terror drones (while flak tracks are better one on one then gattling tanks, flak tracks don't fire on the move, which gatt tanks). If I would trow in a few magnetrons also, I can defeat your mix of units with mine, while spending ALOT of cash less then you.

I suggest reading the complete topic before replying :).
1. See above post...
2. Yeah, but they would be quickly chewed up by those gattling tanks you keep mentioning, and/or nearby gattling cannons.
3. It would take a bit of time to get the FTs to the grinder; the rhinos would do their job in the meantime if the commander uses teams and times the attack correctly.
4. Okay so yuri's psychic power would then have to come from either yuri clones, yuriprimes or masterminds. Spamming FTs would work against any of that, since infantry is quickly wiped out by the flak and masterminds overload if they mind control too many units. Not to mention, YCs, YPs and MMs are all prone to terror drones. Using MMs instead of towers would help you save power I guess, but not much beyond that.

Regarding the Kirov strategy, you use teams; put the FTs in front and the TDs a ways back. When yuri's GTs come to shoot down the kirovs they get confronted by the FTs, while the GTs are occupied you sneak in with the TDs and have them do their thing. It seems to work for me.

I don't exactly have the time nor patience to read through all 17 pages just to make a quick post of strategies that work for me :).

[truefeel]

My tactic rellies on there being large scale battles for prolonged warfare, yours is to build a few units, rush the enmy, and hope to strike a fatal blow. they are two completely different types of play. The thing is, if you don't beat me early game, you won't win. The longer the game goes the better i get by order of magnitude. The trick is going to be getting me in the early game.
It's far from that. You see, you don't "rush" on most maps, but attack rather "early". There's a big difference between that (especially economic wise). Second, it is not some or desperate attempt for "all or nothing". No it is called harrasment. If I'm not able to deliver a death blow then, I still can do that afterwarths. You see, if I'm carefull and do not loose many units, I still have those and economic wise I would not be tailing you either.

I was under the impression that we were fighting so we could more adequetly explain each others tactics through battle rather than words.Partly.

1. See above post...Ok, I overreaded that. My excuses.

2. Yeah, but they would be quickly chewed up by those gattling tanks you keep mentioning, and/or nearby gattling cannons.So would also flak tracks, and gatt cannons are hardly build.

3. It would take a bit of time to get the FTs to the grinder; the rhinos would do their job in the meantime if the commander uses teams and times the attack correctly.If he has a grinder, he would push the fight to his base, wouldn't he ? that means only a short delay (especially b/c flak tracks are fast). Not that it matters anyway. Psy tower, gatt cannons, prism towers,... in short all static defences are almost not build in online play, b/c units can forfill the same and can also go offensively. Therefore you'll only see a psy tower opping up when the yuri player is in trouble (like you sneaked in a seal in his base, he notices it and pops up a psy tower), but an online player will never make static defences at the cost of less units.

4. Okay so yuri's psychic power would then have to come from either yuri clones, yuriprimes or masterminds. Spamming FTs would work against any of that, since infantry is quickly wiped out by the flak and masterminds overload if they mind control too many units. Not to mention, YCs, YPs and MMs are all prone to terror drones. Using MMs instead of towers would help you save power I guess, but not much beyond that.Psy power is only a small part of yuri. Psy power alone is nothing to be worried about. The problem is that yuri has units,almost all decent units, with alot of them being extra good in one particular thing. Yuri uses mixes of those units. Where allieds and soviets rely on brute tank force in big numbers, yuri only needs a few of some types of his units. And that mix covers up almost ALL the weaknesses. The key unit though is the magnetron, being able to lift vehicles from the ground and actually stunning them. On top of that people can let magnetrons auto target (called here auto magging), so magnetrons pick up automatically the closest unit, resulting that 2-3 magnetrons can lift up a larger force of vehicles, stunning them on top of that so that other yuri vehicles can take some free shots at it for 1-2 seconds, or maybe mind control them. So if you use flak tracks with terror drones and I use a few gatt tanks with a few masterminds and some lashers and a pair of magnetrons, I would win against that, not b/c I am good, but only b/c that mix is hardly stoppable

Regarding the Kirov strategy, you use teams; put the FTs in front and the TDs a ways back. When yuri's GTs come to shoot down the kirovs they get confronted by the FTs, while the GTs are occupied you sneak in with the TDs and have them do their thing. It seems to work for me.What would stop a human player from noticing it before you have got around with your TDs? Not that it is a realistic strategy: if you mass kirovs, it means you are not making ground troops and I could easily go to your base and basicilly end the game, b/c you are spending your money on slow kirovs and that leaves no money for something else.

I don't exactly have the time nor patience to read through all 17 pages just to make a quick post of strategies that work for me :).That's a problem then. You don't really understand how yuri works and that is exactly explained in these 17 pages.

Alright look I'll reinstall it if I can this week. The snow has caused a major laspe in things so won't have anything to do the entire week. but if I get one more of those errors I'm saying **** it.

Did you tried xwis help yet? Also which fan patch did you used ?

[GettinGwap]

Wow, it's amazing how so many players get this Yuri topic so wrong. I consider myself relatively new(been playing online for about 8-9 months), and I completely understand how dangerous Yuri is. Lol it's just funny how many people who i assume have been playing longer don't understand it just yet.:lol:

[truefeel]

It's a matter if you play online or not. Back in the days when I did not played online, I believed quite frankly the same, until I got pwned on a similar subject by piscinex, aka the walking library of RA2 and YR. Then I got into online play and slowly I learned the game.

[YuriPrime]

It's a matter if you play online or not. Back in the days when I did not played online, I believed quite frankly the same, until I got pwned on a similar subject by piscinex, aka the walking library of RA2 and YR. Then I got into online play and slowly I learned the game.
:rofl: My bad, here I thought we were talking about beating an AI Yuri. Online play, well, that is a domain I have yet to explore.

One thing though, I can't seem to get "auto magging" to work. The magnetrons don't do anything unless I manually select a target for them.

[truefeel]

lolz, can't blame you. Yeh, a human player is of course far better an AI.

I don't like to explain how auto mag is been done (although it is not exactly a secret trick either) b/c I myself consider it very lame to utilise it. However, you search at xwis forums about it if you really want to.

[GettinGwap]

Did you and the guy ever play Truefeel?

[truefeel]

Did not heard anything of it. I'm gonna ask it on msn one last time and else **** it. We could do some games MAYBE (so no promise) wednesday, gettingwap :).

[GettinGwap]

Did not heard anything of it. I'm gonna ask it on msn one last time and else **** it. We could do some games MAYBE (so no promise) wednesday, gettingwap :).

k, i got aim now so maybe we can correspond with each other.

[truefeel]

Problem is that I don't have AIM :p. Just sent me a PM which time you want.

[apple23]

I will be online on YR for pretty much the whole rest of the day around 6:00-ish (GMT -7:00. So in other words, exactly 3 hours and 32 minutes from the exact time I made this post). I am coordinating some video production between my 2 computers (gotta have a player 2, eh?) and will be using the regular XWIS online service. Feel free to contact me any time if you catch me online. My parent username is AbOmBNuke, my other username (the acc on my player 2 computer) is nuker7739. You may also see nuker7738, which is me as well. It doesn't matter which acc you contact me on, both computers are in the same small room.

Also: Whilst making the videos I speak of, my parent account will be "AFK" (but really just minimised the game). If I don't respond immediately, just page my other account (nuker7739).

I will post the exact time I get on when I get on.

[truefeel]

I will not be able to make it. It'll be for the weekend.

[apple23]

well, the weekend has arrived, and since I am sick today I'm stuck home all day. If anyone is up for a match, send me a pager message. I'll keep the forums website open, so I'll get the notification right away, and we'll see about setting up a match.

[truefeel]

Due the big difference in time (with me anyway), I suggest we use this thread about which times exactly, so post up your time (plz mention which timezone also) and we'll see about it.

[tacchan14]

Units and offensive tactics aside, can anybody tell me how the Soviet economy can rival Yuri's, especially when the game wears on?

[ThePsychoturtle]

Units and offensive tactics aside, can anybody tell me how the Soviet economy can rival Yuri's, especially when the game wears on?

Everyone knows that Yuri economy is the best,but its kinda more expensive,even though a miner costs 1750 (less than a ref) it also costs that much in the war factory,and soviet miners collect more than Yuri miners (yuri also cant sell off useless refs because he doesn't make refs),so just distract a yuri player with some light force of annoying units and send the rest of the attack force to pick on this miners,it will cost him to rebuild^^
So to fight Yuris economy,thats the solution.

Did you know that desos can attack the slave miner in its collecting mode? :P

[tacchan14]

Everyone knows that Yuri economy is the best,but its kinda more expensive,even though a miner costs 1750 (less than a ref) it also costs that much in the war factory,and soviet miners collect more than Yuri miners (yuri also cant sell off useless refs because he doesn't make refs),so just distract a yuri player with some light force of annoying units and send the rest of the attack force to pick on this miners,it will cost him to rebuild^^
So to fight Yuris economy,thats the solution.

Did you know that desos can attack the slave miner in its collecting mode? :P

Yes the desos are excellent against those little and hard-working slaves, but we need a to-the-crux solution to eradicate the slave miner in one go. A potent Yuri player can guard his slaves, and it's such a shame that miners are immune to terror drone. It just pisses me off when the screen is full of those slave miners earning Yuri an almost passive income, while the other types of miners have to travel to and fro. As the game wears on, it works towards Yuri.

[truefeel]

Yes the desos are excellent against those little and hard-working slaves, but we need a to-the-crux solution to eradicate the slave miner in one go. A potent Yuri player can guard his slaves, and it's such a shame that miners are immune to terror drone. It just pisses me off when the screen is full of those slave miners earning Yuri an almost passive income, while the other types of miners have to travel to and fro. As the game wears on, it works towards Yuri.

In other words there is almost no cost-effective way to do a massive blow to yuri's economy. On small maps there is, but you gotta be able to pull this off:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LJ2jEdihQFM

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VWaIjKwN1uY&feature=related

[Statalyzer]

(yuri also cant sell off useless refs because he doesn't make refs)

That's sometimes a help for Yuri because you can't blow 1 or 2 buildings and bring his entire economy to a halt.

[tacchan14]

In other words there is almost no cost-effective way to do a massive blow to yuri's economy. On small maps there is, but you gotta be able to pull this off:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LJ2jEdihQFM

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VWaIjKwN1uY&feature=related

Got you. It's the old rule of early desos keep on disrupting his economy. Breathless control from the Soviet side, becoz if he had dropped the guerilla warfare by a moment, he would have been shred.

However, the Yuri guy was even worse than an AI (is that person on board :shy:?). He had the technical lab and should be able to generate virii to combat the desos. You could also see the rhinos ran away from the masterminds, why didn't he do a persuit? Even if a persuit meant that the mastermind would be droned, it is cost effective.

In general the slave miner appears to be the most abject advantage enjoyed by Yuri, but if it is dronable the Yurista would complain about the disadvantage.

Time to get myself an original copy (mine is currently on ISO) and battle with you guys. I feel grateful that RA2/YR is still alive after 9 years!:rant:

[ThePsychoturtle]

Got you. It's the old rule of early desos keep on disrupting his economy. Breathless control from the Soviet side, becoz if he had dropped the guerilla warfare by a moment, he would have been shred.

However, the Yuri guy was even worse than an AI (is that person on board :shy:?). He had the technical lab and should be able to generate virii to combat the desos. You could also see the rhinos ran away from the masterminds, why didn't he do a persuit? Even if a persuit meant that the mastermind would be droned, it is cost effective.

In general the slave miner appears to be the most abject advantage enjoyed by Yuri, but if it is dronable the Yurista would complain about the disadvantage.

Time to get myself an original copy (mine is currently on ISO) and battle with you guys. I feel grateful that RA2/YR is still alive after 9 years!:rant:


You don't need an original copy,even a fake one works on Hamachi,me and truefeel played some games there,join the network YRhamachi with the password 123456 and just make an agreement with me or truefeel and we will play you one day :)

[truefeel]

However, the Yuri guy was even worse than an AI (is that person on board :shy:?). He had the technical lab and should be able to generate virii to combat the desos. You could also see the rhinos ran away from the masterminds, why didn't he do a persuit? Even if a persuit meant that the mastermind would be droned, it is cost effective.

Believe it or not, but the yuri player in the video is a multiple rank 1 YR ladder winner, but yeh: he's a big pushover and has already been caught several times cheating (he should had been perm banned, but somehow the admins found a way to make a exception).

[tacchan14]

I joined the YRHamachi VPN with the nickname S. All of the members appeared to be offline, and should I choose 'Internet' inside the game to match?

[ThePsychoturtle]

I joined the YRHamachi VPN with the nickname S. All of the members appeared to be offline, and should I choose 'Internet' inside the game to match?

Network is to play with other guys on hamachi,you just need to set a time with one of us here,I will be available tomorrow night,in CET,whats your time zone?

[truefeel]

To be completely sure, psychoturtle:
a) are you gonna show up :p?

b)around which time do you want? we could do some games already if tacchan is available at a later time (which I doubt; his timezone is GMT+0, only 1 hour behind us).

[ThePsychoturtle]

To be completely sure, psychoturtle:
a) are you gonna show up :p?

b)around which time do you want? we could do some games already if tacchan is available at a later time (which I doubt; his timezone is GMT+0, only 1 hour behind us).

Last time something really came up in the last minute,this time I am 99% sure I will come,I will probably be available from 18:00 or 18:30

[tacchan14]

I will connect to hamachi tomorrow evening, tentatively from 8pm to 11pm.

[truefeel]

You have as timezone GMT+0, right?

Oh btw: I might not make it tommorow. Some private things I need to take care off and I'm not sure if that'll take a few minutes or a few hours.

[tacchan14]

You have as timezone GMT+0, right?

Oh btw: I might not make it tommorow. Some private things I need to take care off and I'm not sure if that'll take a few minutes or a few hours.

Yes, im in london. I will see you if you are there.

[ThePsychoturtle]

ok guys I'm ready right now,who is ready with me?

[truefeel]

Seems it only took a few minutes. Ok, I am on now.

[tacchan14]

Seems you guys are quite free during the day. Don't you have to work?

I am on at the moment, UK time 730pm.

[truefeel]

Remember we are 1 hour ahead ;). k, also remember we are using Hamachi.

[Teron]

My memory may fail be a bit, but I was somewhat stunned at the Slave Miner's inability to kill the dogs that harassed it (marko vs. sunny pt1, up to 40 secs or so). Shouldn't the canine have been killed much more quickly?

EDIT: Watched the first part in full. Ugly, that's all I can say. The Yuri player was basically toyed with the entire game. Why he didn't make Virii is a complete mystery to me though, he had radar up like forever. The tanks wouldn't have been a problem either, the Soviet player seemed to be really afraid of the Yuri player's Mags. It's like the Yuri player just handed the game over with that decision.

[truefeel]

Lol, you should see that guy his posts at xwis; he's a bit crazy in the head:nuts:.

[Afrikorps]

Sov versus yuri is impossible man. At least against a decent yuri player. But truefeel I'm gettin my internet up when I move ima make a comeback. I'm sure you'll kill me, but I need to get back in the groove of things.