How Will You Mod CnC 3? [Archive] - Den Games Network Forums

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Star Wars Man

03-17-2007, 06:55 PM

SgtRicko

03-18-2007, 01:58 AM

All I'm going to do is just change the silos limit and add in walls, thats it.

BTW, steath artillery... I think you're on to something, buddy!:chin: Here's to hoping they add it in the Ex Pack!

Star Wars Man

03-18-2007, 12:45 PM

What I may do also is impliment shotgun infantry by copying the Shredder Turret's weapon. (Interesting to see how that'll work out. :D)

Aikichi

03-22-2007, 12:09 PM

Myself I will probably make a total conversion mod with some of my friends. We were discussing perhaps doing a starcraft remake and keeping it on the down low because we all know how blizzard gets.

Wildfire

03-23-2007, 11:36 PM

I want to mod it to reflect this book called "Battle Born" by Dale Brown, and in the dale brown universe...I dont know exactly the name i want to use but trust i have some ideas i've been writing them down and the story n stuff

Fenring

03-24-2007, 08:30 AM

I'm going to be doing conversions for C&C3: one based on the original Red Alert and a futuristic sci-fi kinda thing... think Starcraft for this one.

Daishi

03-24-2007, 08:42 AM

C&C3 might be a great opportunity to make the Total Conversion mod I've been dreaming up for a while. Hopefully we'll see some lunar packages in the finished product, that'll help a lot.

SgtRicko

03-24-2007, 11:44 AM

I had an interesting dream last night... I believe it was the result of me going to bed immediately after reading a line on the forum about how the build system in Generals was superior or something... ah well, here goes...

I'll summarize the dream in saying that it was a Nod vs. USA match that I was observing, and it actually was incredibly intense and far more balanced than I ever thought possible. Sure, it was odd that every time the view switched to the USA player's base it all of a sudden went from Small Town USA to Homeland Alliance, and vice-versa for the Nod player (who, BTW, was in the NW corner), but the whole thing about the two corner expansions was indeed present... and it's actually this particular detail that made the game interesting.

You see, the Nod player had rushed to build an expansion in the SE corner, but the USA player had opted to rush a dozer directly in front of the Nod player's base in order to attempt a barracks rush while expanding to the NW at the same time. While the barrack rush failed due to a scorpian tank catching the dozer just outside of the Nod base, the USA player successfully set up the expansion with no hitches, and had two patriots guarding it. A few moments later, Nod then attacks the USA main base, only to get hassled by a couple of Commanches with rocket pods, which soon get shot down by a group of Nod attack bikes. As with any good game, the attacks went on and on, until Nod came out the better due to a engie+base def. raid on the NW expansion, which ruined the USA player's economy (NOTE: he actually had two Drop Zones!!!).

In the end, the USA player lost due to the Nod player's insane build speed for everything. That, and because the Avatars kinda raped everything in the USA arsenal pretty badly, but that was probably the only imbalance there was. You'd also think that the Nod player would be at a disadvantage due to the USA player's dozers build-anywhere, but it actually played out good! It was, dare I say it -- balanced, despite the obvious quirks between games, speed being the biggest one of all.

Granted, there were a s***load of things that didn't make sense in the match, this being a dream and all. The Generals powers were absent (yet USA still built Pathvees and stealth fighters), the Crusader was oddly absent, Rangers were built in groups of four, yet still worked individually, a Nuke Cannon popped into the fray on the USA side for no apparent reason and I was playing the game on my OUTDATED comp (never mind the fact I was dressed in a pink too-too)!!!:freek:

The worst of all though, was the resource gathering -- USA was using CHINOOKS to harvest Tiberium by scooping it up with the hook, and then dropping it on the supply center like any other supply drop -- Man, if only I could've shown you the stupidity of that process in my dream, you d00ds woulda died of laughter!!!!:roflmao: :rofl: :lmao: :lol:

Now, the reason why I brought this damn odd dream to your attention is because it showed me how surprisingly balanced the two games' build styles are in comparison to each. Sure, the Generals player could build wherever he pleased, and could also transport his units MUCH more easily than Nod could, but so could the Tib Wars player with the emissaries and the Carry-alls. There really was no massive imbalance between the build styles, nor any severe oversight of some type on either side during the match. Who knows, maybe if a few balance tweaks were made to the build speed, units and such, it could actually work out really well!

(FTR, the map played was Small Town USA - you know, the one from the C&C3 demo. Don't let that line about Homeland Alliance confuse you!)

Daishi

03-24-2007, 12:11 PM

Whoa. This ownage dream deserves its own thread in the C&C3 section.

(never mind the fact I was dressed in a pink too-too)i think I'll save this little snippet for laughs. :lol: :p

I've never had a C&C dream, the only dream I ever had regarding a video game was the dream that I had a golden wand (which doesn't exist btw) in Gunbound Revolution.

Anyway, is there a good alternative to gmax to model for the SAGE engine? I need one.

SgtRicko

03-24-2007, 12:34 PM

Whoa. This ownage dream deserves its own thread in the C&C3 section.

i think I'll save this little snippet for laughs. :lol: :p

I've never had a C&C dream, the only dream I ever had regarding a video game was the dream that I had a golden wand (which doesn't exist btw) in Gunbound Revolution.

Anyway, is there a good alternative to gmax to model for the SAGE engine? I need one.

Really!?! Thanks!:shy:

BTW, do you think it could work??? You know, modding the Generals factions slightly so they could fight against the C&C3 factions? Honestly, after that dream, I really do believe now it can work out!!!!:chin:

Daishi

03-24-2007, 12:47 PM

Chances are you won't be able to recycle most of the coding from Gen/ZH. But yeah, you could add the two games up, it seems.

Too bad GLA won't have much of a chance...

SgtRicko

03-24-2007, 12:52 PM

GLA wouldn't fit in, period, due to the extreme amount of differences between them and all of the other races, with the biggest being the power demand that they lack, and the foot workers being rediculously vunerable to tiberium.:gnarly:

Kiefer13

03-25-2007, 03:02 PM

I think I'll mabye add a few units to both sides and mabye tweak some stuff. Dunno really since i don't actually have the game yet.

Daishi

03-26-2007, 11:03 AM

HelloDave

03-26-2007, 11:17 AM

In a few months I'd start making some ridicolous mod which I then wouldn't finish because I can't be botherd and come back to it after a few months and it would either be completed,2 thirds completed or not done at all.

SgtRicko

03-27-2007, 12:45 AM

"My hands have tumors!"

"Thank you for the new rad-suit!":dead:

Seriously, the only way the GLA build style would work is if they had the poor guys hop into some SCV-like powersuits that were immune to tiberium or something.

mrchris

04-01-2007, 11:57 PM

I could tell you what I will do once the editing tools come out officially..

Increase Construction Yard health
Increase power output by 400-500% (Why? Cause I don't like a ton of power plants cluttering up my base)
Double reactor upgrade output
Reduce speed, increase damage of Nod Fanatics
Slightly decrease Scrin shielding
Increase tiberium and spread value
Increase Refinery and Silo capacity dramatically
Increase harvester health
Increase health of anti-infantry defenses
Increase autobuild time on Nod turrets
Increase aircraft speed slightly
Kill the shroud (easy to do, give the CY a vision of 9999, as you could in Gen/ZH):))
Increase damage for infantry anti-armor weapons
Increase timers for support powers and superweapons (Why? 7 minutes is not long enough. Personally, I would set it to 20 or 30 minutes)
Decrease price on most everything
Increase spread for shockwave artillery
Increase efficiency of small arms vs infantry

MercZ

04-03-2007, 12:13 AM

I'd like to try and add some radiation to the Nod nuke, and have a blast affect on things like trees for the super weapons.

I probably won't get too far, but I think someone will probably do it.

SgtRicko

04-03-2007, 07:18 AM

One thing this game needs badly is some kind of repair unit for Nod, maybe even a medic. As it is, the WF's drones are only good if you're repairing units located at your base, not on the field.

mrchris

04-03-2007, 12:49 PM

Darkwander

04-05-2007, 05:13 AM

I want to do the following:

Add more units to Nod / GDI (Air and Ground)
Add Walls
Add Fences Nod: Lazer (TS) and Something for GDI
Add a Few more races and base one of them on Stargate Atantis - Atlantians

JBV3737

04-06-2007, 12:46 AM

In reply to the dream post:

lol sorry to say it but your dream is about to die.
generals had INI.files, cnc3 completely converted to XML.files; as well many other files where changes and converted and compressed to save game/map loading times. the SAGE engien may be inact but it is changed to a degree that i believe is completely impossible.

the ideas before the "Dream": you, or I may be able to do those changes without making a mod but simply adding an XML.file override, in BFME 2 i was able to create and edit almost everything new without a mod, just a map.
I will see when worldbuilder and the offical mod programs are released.

If you dont know what INI.files/XML.files do in cnc3/bfme/generals; this is what they do: basicly set the values for everything to work and fall into place; from animations, weapon damages, FX particle effects, unit healths, modules, armorsets, commandsets, the list could for for several more pages. basicly if you didn't have a XML.file or INI.files for any of these games you would be left with raw data and pictures of textures/particle TGAS object skins. EA GAMES converted all of this. so unless want to redo all of that to bring some generals into cnc3... Have fun in spending 2 or so years doing so... lol :)

Darkwander

04-06-2007, 02:09 AM

Why can't we just use the mod when it comes out ?

regs120

04-07-2007, 05:33 PM

They are releasing mod tools?

Relic said the same thing when Company Of Heroes came out and they still don't have anything for it.

Darkwander

04-07-2007, 09:12 PM

Hey guys,

So there has been a ton of speculation, rumors, flames, mis-guided quotes, all surrounding one of your favorite aspects of Command & Conquer 3, modding.

I am not going to make a long winded message here, I merely want to affirm our status on the topic and where we are going.

It is our goal to match and exceed your modding capabilities which you've had with Generals, Zero Hour, and BFME based on the last MOD SDK release and simply that which the game allowed you to do. It would not be good to move backwards, right? Well, anyone who thinks we are because we now have XML instead of INI files and a new build pipeline is wrong.

The reason your load times are so incredibly fast in the game is because of the new build pipeline and the XML switch. We did a lot to the inner-workings of this game to increase performance from top to bottom. It was 100% necessary. Because of that, we have some understandable new challenges to keep C&C as the most heavily modded RTS period, and continue catering to you guys.

I've said this many times, modding is extremely important to me, to Mike Verdu, to Amer Ajami, and to the EALA studio. We've turned over a new leaf this past year with our first MOD SDK release and granted its not perfect, its certainly got a lot to offer.

We are absolutely committed to creating a new MOD SDK for Command & Conquer 3 and getting that in your hands in as efficient timeline as possible with our resources. Our development team is currently rotating on vacations now that the game is gold, we need some breathing room and a break after a long-hard project! But, work has already started on the SDK, and that simply means starting to analyze how we can open up the new build pipeline to you guys with something accessible and easy to understand.

I am working closely with some of the top modders in the community to ensure we're including the best tools and assets, so you needn't worry that we're only doing this internally. We realize a lot of great community mod tools are out there and we want to embrace that knowledge and work together. A lot of tools modders create are not officially sanctioned and otherwise would not be created by us...BUT...that does not mean we cannot verbally support and promote them if they are viable and safe, which most often I've found them to be.

So, now that i've made a long winded reply which I said I would not, haha, here is the bottom line...

We're dedicated and committed to the Command & Conquer MOD scene and we will do everything in our power to support it with Worldbuilder, and a new SDK release after launch. We don't have a set timeline yet, but we also realize its not something that the community can afford to wait a long time for, thats just logical perfect sense. I do not want to make any promises right now, but I just wanted to re-affirm that we are very much committed to a new SDK and doing everything possible to open up the right systems in the game so you can MOD as you always have.

Hopefully this clears the air for now, will definitely keep you posted, hang tight, no worries.

-Predator

Message was edited by:
EALA Predator (C& C)

Message was edited by:
EALA Predator (C&C)

Message was edited by:
EALA Predator (C&C)

Source: http://forums.ea.com/mboards/thread.jspa?sls=2&threadID=196203

darkelf2x1

04-08-2007, 08:28 AM

Just wanted to know what some members will modify when C & C 3 comes out.

I'll most likely do the following things:

- Increase the amount of Tiberium Silos can hold (It gets annoying when every couple of minutes "Silos Needed" plays)
- Have the Avatar Warmech's Laser fire continuously, like the beam cannon's.
- Increase the Stealth Tank's attack range (Going to have it be like a stealthed artillery :D)
- Reduce or rid the cost for the special abilities (I may do something else.)
- Increase Nod's nuke damage range.

And other bits and pieces.

How will you mod the game?

the avatar is supposed to be more a walking obelisk

- - - - -

reenable the mammoth mark 2, titans, wolverines, etc... the reason they gave for getting rid of walkers is too flimsy in my opinion because they kept some walkers

- - -

scrin
allow other walking vehicle to be taken down with charges

- - - - -

or remove all the nod and gdi walkers
which makes more sense

...

one word...

FIRESTORM

arcom

04-25-2007, 03:09 PM

Every picture of the Orca shows that it has a gatling gun on the nose. First thing I'd do is add the Venom's machine gun onto the Orca so it can chew up infantry.

erikm

05-10-2007, 12:47 PM

I've got some ideas for mod factions.

One mod faction I'd like to see is one where almost every building is redeployable. I'll call the faction the Nomads.

Basically, you'd have a heavy factory which builds MCV sized vehicles. These could then deploy into the barracks, command center, etc. Base defence vehicles would be Predator- or Rig-sized, but only operational when deployed. The only buildings that would not be re-deployable would be the heavy factory, walls and gates. Timers etc. would restart on deployment.

Another interesting mod faction is be one that I'll call Towers.

Basically, everything in their base, except the walls and maybe the defenses, would be part of one big building. Extra units would be attached tinker-toy style to the top of the existing tower or tower base, taking up all or part of the level. The war factory and barracks would need to be at ground level. Landing pads and such might block the roof. Building the base of a new tower would only be possible with a MCV.

And then there's various ideas around for making individual troop types more versatile. Multiple switchable or upgradable weapons loadouts, going prone, using bulldozer blades for combat engineering (digging in or building berms) and laying razorwire. Mobile bridging sets look difficult to do but promising . . .

ErikM :devil:

Star Wars Man

05-10-2007, 03:25 PM

Wow, forgot this thread was here.

Now that I have the game, I'll do the following things:

Put walls back in (So tired of everyone bitching about this).
Increase most aircraft's health by 10-15%.
If I can figure out death animations, I'll change the Scrin Stormrider so it really looks like it crash lands.
Increase the amount of Tiberium Silos can hold.
Have the Avatar Warmech's Laser fire continuously, like the beam cannon's.
Increase the Stealth Tank's attack range.
Reduce or rid the cost for the special abilities (Like in the original CNC.)
Increase Nod's nuke damage and AOE.

Quadhelix

05-11-2007, 06:27 PM

According to this thread: http://forums.cncden.com/showthread.php?t=19527, Harvesters can bring back $2,400 per load of green Tiberium! I just now tested the Harvesters in Tiberian Sun, and a single load took my assets from $7,700 to $8,400. For those reading this who hate math, that is $700 per load of green Tiberium. In short, the Harvesters in Tiberium Wars carry over three times the value in Tiberium as their Tiberian Sun counterparts :dismay:. The end result is that it is far too easy in Tiberium Wars to amass huge armies with just a small number of Harvesters (which, until the 1.05 patch, cost less than their Tiberian Sun counterparts).

Thesis: The value of Tiberium in Tiberium Wars should be drastically reduced.

edit (5/12/2007):

Other Ideas (note: feasibility not guaranteed):

1. Change Scrin unit production dynamic: Since all the Scrin units are teleported onto the battlefield from the mothership and were, theoretically, constructed long before the Scrin ever departed for Earth, it would makes little sense for the Scrin to have to pay for their units. Instead, each Scrin Unit producer (namely, Portals, Warp Spheres, and Gravity Stabilizers) should act somewhat like a Reinforcement Pad from Generals: Zero Hour, bringing a free unit every few minutes, but with Strategy Center logic to allow each unit producer to "call in" a specific unit (i.e., you can command your Portal to warp in Shock Trooper Squads each time it brings in reinforcements).

2. Give Nod subterranean units, if possible.

3. Less Anti-Stealth. Maybe make it so that the "Anti-Stealth Units" (Pitbull, Attack Bike, and Seeker) can detect only the presence of cloaked units and buildings, not their actual location. Maybe give each side a "Mobile Sensor Array" type of unit that can reveal the location of cloaked buildings, but not units, of which it can detect only the presence. Also, the "Disruption Tower" should at the very least have an upgrade allowing it to cloak itself.

4. An idea I had based on the status of the real army (at least according to an article in either Popular Science of Popular Mechanics) is to have each human infantry squad (with some exceptions, such as Zone Troopers, Sniper Teams, Shadow Troopers, Black Hand Troopers, and Scrin infantry in general) come equipped with a "Commander" or "Communications Soldier." If a squads Commander is killed, orders must be relayed to that squad via nearby squads. If a squad isolated from the rest of the Player's forces loses its Commander, the Player loses all control of that squad. Commanders are only slightly stronger that a single Rifleman or Militant, and obviously cost less than the squad as a whole when trained independently of a squad (which you would do to replace lost squad Commanders).

Cylon Crusader

05-15-2007, 08:26 AM

- Iom cannon has EMP ability the moment those beams touch the ground to help stop vehicles and to disable buildings, EMP effect lasts for 1 minute.

-Nod nuke has radioactive capability like in RA 2 and yuris revenge.

-GDI artillery srike support power, 2 things either increse recharge rate or increase dameage and number of shells.

-GDI light tank with a 50 mm cannon and a ligh machine gun for infantry.

-Orcas have machinegun or gattling gun on nose like in the trailer for chewing up infantry.

-Seed tiberium increases tiberium production by 5x.

-Predator tank has a 2 rocket pods om sides as an upgrade.

-All nod units and buildings armour increased by 25% except for avatar mech which gets a 5 % armour upgrade.

-Scrin need tib silos but they can store alot of tiberium.

-New GDI unit, Cairo class command baseship, flying unit that can deploy into a base that includes barracks, war factory and airfield that can house 2 orcas. barracks and wf can build minor units: rifleman, rocket, grenadier squads and wf can produce APCs, predators and pitbulls. Baseship also includes when deployed, 4 grancannon turrets, 6 guard towers and 2 sonic towers.Also included arer 4 AA towers, it can repair vehicles, aircraft and heal infantry, 5 infantry squads can be garrisined in it as well as 2 predator tanks. when in flight the base ship has slow speed but can use an upgrade caled retro boosters which gives it a 25% speed increase for 1 minute, upgrade costs 1000 credits. in flight the base ship has 6 gattling guns for infnatry and aircraft. It also has,while in flight, 4 grand cannons for anti tank defense/assaults. Limit:1.Cost:20,000 credits and it can survive 2 superweapon attacks but one attack from the rift generator.

-Rift generator costs 7000 credits and has .50x more damage and radius increases by 0.50x.

-New GDI tank limit 5, has 3 cannons already with rail gun upgrades, an AA cannon, 2 gatting cannons for infantry and aircraft, 2x more armour than the mammoth cost:5000, basically its the equivalent of 5 mammoth tanks.

This is all I have for now, if there are any spelling errors thats because im doing this from school and theres a teacher around so u do the math.

EliteGi

05-15-2007, 08:34 AM

-All nod units and buildings armour increased by 25% except for avatar mech which gets a 5 % armour upgrade.
You're crazy! Now don't get me wrong, I like you.

But you're crazy.

Daishi

05-15-2007, 08:43 AM

Some people don't understand the intended root of all Nod military tactics: Guile.

Quadhelix

05-15-2007, 01:54 PM

-Iom cannon has EMP ability the moment those beams touch the ground to help stop vehicles and to disable buildings, EMP effect lasts for 1 minute.

Actually, I feel that it would be better to weaken the Ion Cannon by about 25-50% and make the strike instantaneous, like in Tiberian Sun.

-GDI light tank with a 50 mm cannon and a ligh machine gun for infantry.

Nod has light tanks, GDI has medium tanks. By C&C3, "light tanks," namely Nod Scorpions, have 105mm cannon. Thus, your proposed light tank neither matches its intended faction's force composition nor is it properly armed for its niche.

-Seed tiberium increases tiberium production by 5x.

Or at least make the Tiberium grow. Then again, current Tiberium is far too valuable as things stand.

Darkwander

05-15-2007, 06:58 PM

I am going to add 5 new races to the game that are all based on Stargate.

Ancients http://www.delightsoftheflesh.com/private/C%20&%20C%203/Ancients.doc
Earth http://www.delightsoftheflesh.com/private/C%20&%20C%203/Earth.doc
Goa'uld http://www.delightsoftheflesh.com/private/C%20&%20C%203/Goauld.doc
Wraith http://www.delightsoftheflesh.com/private/C%20&%20C%203/Wraith.doc
Ori http://www.delightsoftheflesh.com/private/C%20&%20C%203/Ori.doc

Cylon Crusader

05-16-2007, 07:19 AM

Darkwander

05-16-2007, 07:54 AM

Same way that i am going to do the Ancients?

Are you asking how am i going to actually put the units "Ori" or how am i going to make the group called "Ori"?

Cylon Crusader

05-16-2007, 08:34 AM

Same way that i am going to do the Ancients?

Are you asking how am i going to actually put the units "Ori" or how am i going to make the group called "Ori"?

nevermind forget i asked-ion cannon strike is weakened by 10% due to EMP.

-Return of nod subterranean units.

-Tiberium viens that can be harvested by a special harvesterthat costs 2000 credits, has twice as much armour than the regular harvester and has a machinegun on top.

-You get to play as mutants, they have no vehicles but their units are really cheap.Mutant hovel=Barracks, Mutant Cave=Crane that can store multiple unit squads and can be used as a tunnel netwoork like in generals and zero hour. Units include mutant engineer that has 2x armour than regular engineer and can build hovels and caves as well as repairing them and neutral structures on maps, mutant hijacker is a nod back to the original games he can hijack any enemy vehicle and is stealthed, mutant corpser squads can completely anihilate enemy infantry, vehicles, buildings and air craft. When you click on the mutant corpser icon in the side bar when you want to build them, there will be a random number of guys with rockets and rifles.And last but not the least, the mutant saboteur can C-12 enemy buildings, has a rifle that doubles as a rocket launcher and his rifle can shoot twice as far as a garrisoned rifleman squad and is also stealthed, he can run 0.5x faster than the nod commando, his only disadvantage is that he is particularly weak against air units and his stealth intermittently cuts out at random times.
All mutant units cost 500 except the saboteur which costs 1500 credits, mutant engineers can capture tiberium spikes to give them 30 credits instead of the regular 15 and the engineers can also "dig tiberium" by going over to a tiberium field and using their dig ability to harvest tiberium, they can each bring in 700 credits each time and they must deposit their tiberium at the mutant caves.

-New GDI air unit, Crusader class heavy assault fighter can hover has 2 gattling guns and 2 ricket pods on each wing as well as one of those firehawk bombs latched on the underside. It is specifically designed to take out air units and the bomb can be used on ground units. It costs 1200, same as the harrier jump jet in RA 2 and Yuris Revenge and its great for taking out the Scrin aerial units.

-All sides aerial transport units can be buildable Ox for GDI, that carryall like transport for nod and a new transport unit for the Scrin the Scrin Tsunsunati Assault Carrier which costs 1700 credits.

It appears I just got a detention but it was worth it later CNC fanlords ill be back with more later.Actually, I feel that it would be better to weaken the Ion Cannon by about 25-50% and make the strike instantaneous, like in Tiberian Sun.

Nod has light tanks, GDI has medium tanks. By C&C3, "light tanks," namely Nod Scorpions, have 105mm cannon. Thus, your proposed light tank neither matches its intended faction's force composition nor is it properly armed for its niche.

Or at least make the Tiberium grow. Then again, current Tiberium is far too valuable as things stand.

I meant that the tiberium will grow but the seed tiberium will increase its production by 5x for a minute and it cannot work on blue tiberium.

Quadhelix

05-16-2007, 04:52 PM

-Tiberium viens that can be harvested by a special harvesterthat costs 2000 credits, has twice as much armour than the regular harvester and has a machinegun on top.

Yes, but what do you get for harvesting the Tiberium Veins? Money? A chemical weapon? What?

-New GDI air unit, Crusader class heavy assault fighter can hover has 2 gattling guns and 2 ricket pods on each wing as well as one of those firehawk bombs latched on the underside. It is specifically designed to take out air units and the bomb can be used on ground units. It costs 1200, same as the harrier jump jet in RA 2 and Yuris Revenge and its great for taking out the Scrin aerial units.

In other words, an aircraft that costs little more than an Orca ($1100) and less than a Firehawk ($1500) that can do the job of both and more? I fail to see the pupose of this unit other than as a counterpart (anti-infantry) to the Venom.

-Return of nod subterranean units.

2. Give Nod subterranean units, if possible.

Great minds, Cylon Crusader, great minds.

-You get to play as mutants, they have no vehicles but their units are really cheap.Mutant hovel=Barracks, Mutant Cave=Crane that can store multiple unit squads and can be used as a tunnel netwoork like in generals and zero hour. Units include mutant engineer that has 2x armour than regular engineer and can build hovels and caves as well as repairing them and neutral structures on maps, mutant hijacker is a nod back to the original games he can hijack any enemy vehicle and is stealthed, mutant corpser squads can completely anihilate enemy infantry, vehicles, buildings and air craft. When you click on the mutant corpser icon in the side bar when you want to build them, there will be a random number of guys with rockets and rifles.And last but not the least, the mutant saboteur can C-12 enemy buildings, has a rifle that doubles as a rocket launcher and his rifle can shoot twice as far as a garrisoned rifleman squad and is also stealthed, he can run 0.5x faster than the nod commando, his only disadvantage is that he is particularly weak against air units and his stealth intermittently cuts out at random times.
All mutant units cost 500 except the saboteur which costs 1500 credits, mutant engineers can capture tiberium spikes to give them 30 credits instead of the regular 15 and the engineers can also "dig tiberium" by going over to a tiberium field and using their dig ability to harvest tiberium, they can each bring in 700 credits each time and they must deposit their tiberium at the mutant caves.

A faction consisting almost entirely of infantry? Sounds good. Very good.

On a side note, I still think that the value of Tiberium should be reduced to one third, so the Mutant Engineers should probably carry closer to $250 -$300, with regular Harvesters carrying about $800.
(I'm going to end up a broken record on the subject of Tiberium being overvalued, aren't I?:cry:)

Cylon Crusader

05-17-2007, 07:55 AM

Yes, but what do you get for harvesting the Tiberium Veins? Money? A chemical weapon? What?

In other words, an aircraft that costs little more than an Orca ($1100) and less than a Firehawk ($1500) that can do the job of both and more? I fail to see the pupose of this unit other than as a counterpart (anti-infantry) to the Venom.

Great minds, Cylon Crusader, great minds.

A faction consisting almost entirely of infantry? Sounds good. Very good.

On a side note, I still think that the value of Tiberium should be reduced to one third, so the Mutant Engineers should probably carry closer to $250 -$300, with regular Harvesters carrying about $800.
(I'm going to end up a broken record on the subject of Tiberium being overvalued, aren't I?:cry:)

-Yea youre right about the tiberium viens, how about if you collect a certain amount you can "coat" your buildings with it so that if they get destroyed they will release the vien tiberium into the air killing any enemy units and/or structures it touches, the upgrade would cost 700 per building and you can select the building you want to coat with vien tiberium.

-The GDI aircraft should cost say, 1800 to 2000 just to even it out like you said.

-Besides its just a mod, I dont even have CNC 3 for the PC I have it for MY xbox 360 I cant mod it even if I wanted to which I do.

I have more stuff to add so dont think that these are my final thoughts.

Quadhelix

05-17-2007, 03:39 PM

-Yea youre right about the tiberium viens, how about if you collect a certain amount you can "coat" your buildings with it so that if they get destroyed they will release the vien tiberium into the air killing any enemy units and/or structures it touches, the upgrade would cost 700 per building and you can select the building you want to coat with vien tiberium.

The only problem that I can see with that is that such an upgrade would be very much akin to setting off a Chemical Missile in your own base. In RA2, very few players considered it advantageous that their Nuclear Reactor would explode if destroyed. What's worse is that such an upgrade could "cascade"; one build is blown up, which damages another building enough to blow it up, which damages another building enough to blow it up, etc., etc.

-The GDI aircraft should cost say, 1800 to 2000 just to even it out like you said.

The main problem that I have with the aircraft is that it doesn't do anything new; it has Orca weapons and Firehawk weapons. In short, this "Crusader" aircraft is almost too useful because if the player builds it, then he/she does not need to build Orcas or Firehawks

-Besides its just a mod, I dont even have CNC 3 for the PC I have it for MY xbox 360 I cant mod it even if I wanted to which I do.

I don't even have the game, just the demo. :happysad: In other words, take everything that I say with a grain of salt (of course, GDI and Nod are both fully functional in the demo, so my input on them might be useful).

I have more stuff to add so dont think that these are my final thoughts.

I look forward to your future input.

Cylon Crusader

05-18-2007, 07:30 AM

The only problem that I can see with that is that such an upgrade would be very much akin to setting off a Chemical Missile in your own base. In RA2, very few players considered it advantageous that their Nuclear Reactor would explode if destroyed. What's worse is that such an upgrade could "cascade"; one build is blown up, which damages another building enough to blow it up, which damages another building enough to blow it up, etc., etc.

The main problem that I have with the aircraft is that it doesn't do anything new; it has Orca weapons and Firehawk weapons. In short, this "Crusader" aircraft is almost too useful because if the player builds it, then he/she does not need to build Orcas or Firehawks

I don't even have the game, just the demo. :happysad: In other words, take everything that I say with a grain of salt (of course, GDI and Nod are both fully functional in the demo, so my input on them might be useful).

I look forward to your future input.

How about we get rid of the Crusader and use the tiberium vien to make a weapon that is only available to Nod just because they are more inclined to using nuclear missiles and ballistic tactics coupled with stealth, or alternatively, we can get rid of the tiberium viens all together because it was a nuisance in the previous games as well except for Nod cuz they could harvest it.

Daishi

05-18-2007, 08:50 AM

Cylon Crusader

05-18-2007, 11:36 AM

If you want to make more aircraft, make sure you give the scrin one for every aircraft the other factions get. If you want to give GDI anything, it can't be easily supplanted by the orca, firehawk, or even the ox, so there's not much more you could give them. This means whatever you give em, it'll probably be a Tiberium utility of some sort.

You sure about that Daishi cuz the Scrin are already overpowered and are basically the ruler of the skies in CNC 3. Giving them more aircraft will only make them stronger.If you look at it about 15 carriers can easily take out a medium to large sized base within a matter of minutes.

Daishi

05-18-2007, 12:50 PM

Scrin are only OP if you're playing no-rush, which is why you should play properly. They're actually underpowered until they get mid-game units, and even then have to struggle until they get the Tech Center and Stasis Chamber, because that's when they can start creaming Nod and GDI. But what I believe is that gravity stabilizers could also get some some sort of floating plane with a stasis beam to prevent single enemies from retreating. like the Magnetron of RA2, while storm riders and PACs went open season on it.

Quadhelix

05-18-2007, 09:57 PM

To continue my previous list:

Other Ideas (note: feasibility not guaranteed):

1. Change Scrin unit production dynamic: Since all the Scrin units are teleported onto the battlefield from the mothership and were, theoretically, constructed long before the Scrin ever departed for Earth, it would makes little sense for the Scrin to have to pay for their units. Instead, each Scrin Unit producer (namely, Portals, Warp Spheres, and Gravity Stabilizers) should act somewhat like a Reinforcement Pad from Generals: Zero Hour, bringing a free unit every few minutes, but with Strategy Center logic to allow each unit producer to "call in" a specific unit (i.e., you can command your Portal to warp in Shock Trooper Squads each time it brings in reinforcements).

2. Give Nod subterranean units, if possible.

3. Less Anti-Stealth. Maybe make it so that the "Anti-Stealth Units" (Pitbull, Attack Bike, and Seeker) can detect only the presence of cloaked units and buildings, not their actual location. Maybe give each side a "Mobile Sensor Array" type of unit that can reveal the location of cloaked buildings, but not units, of which it can detect only the presence. Also, the "Disruption Tower" should at the very least have an upgrade allowing it to cloak itself.

4. An idea I had based on the status of the real army (at least according to an article in either Popular Science of Popular Mechanics) is to have each human infantry squad (with some exceptions, such as Zone Troopers, Sniper Teams, Shadow Troopers, Black Hand Troopers, and Scrin infantry in general) come equipped with a "Commander" or "Communications Soldier." If a squads Commander is killed, orders must be relayed to that squad via nearby squads. If a squad isolated from the rest of the Player's forces loses its Commander, the Player loses all control of that squad. Commanders are only slightly stronger that a single Rifleman or Militant, and obviously cost less than the squad as a whole when trained independently of a squad (which you would do to replace lost squad Commanders).

5. Reduce Shadow Team ($800) to one unit, a Shadow Operative, and give him the abilities of the GLA Saboteur ($800) from Zero Hour and Hijacker ($400) from vanilla Generals. I am unsure whether or not a cost increase would appropriate (probably, because the original Saboteur was not cloaked and couldn't fly, but the amount stolen from an enemy refinery would have to be increased to compensate for the increased cost).
*Another possibility is to allow the Shadow Operative to switch between Saboteur/Sniper mode and Chameleon Spy/Hijacker mode. As a Saboteur/Sniper, the Shadow Operative is cloaked only when stationary, but can fire while cloaked, and can disable buildings by entering them. In Chameleon Spy/Hijacker mode, the Shadow Operative is cloaked when not using firing, can hijack vehicles, and can enter enemy buildings to give a report on their status (i.e., how much money the enemy has based on his Refinery, how much power based on his power plant, etc.). To keep people from using the Chameleon mode to sneak into the enemy base before switching to Saboteur mode, Shadow Operatives must return to a Secret Shrine to make the transition between modes.

6. I say again, cheaper Tiberium. In Tiberian Sun, a Titan cost $800 when Harvesters brought back loads of $700: less than one Titan per Harvester load. In Tiberium Wars, a Predator Tank costs $1100 when Harvesters bring back $2,400 per load: more than two Predator Tanks each Harvester load. Mammoth Tanks now cost little more than one Harvester load. Tiberium value should be cut in third (and maybe reduce unit cost slightly, i.e., $900 Predator Tank, while increasing build times: NO HORDES!!!!!!).

7. Rename the Flamethrower infantry to "Purifier Squad" or something similar and make the Black Hand Troopers a covert ops unit: cloaked when not firing, can swim, and can climb cliffs and walls. Possible armaments (pick one) include laser rifles, Tiberium gas grenades, plasma cannon, etc. They might "inherit" the Shadow Team's demo charge ability if the Shadow Operative is used in the Shadow Teams' place.

Edit:

1b. What I meant by "you can command your Portal to warp in Shock Trooper Squads each time it brings in reinforcements" is that you can give your Portal one command so that whenever it receives reinforcements, those reinforcements are shock troopers. Also, the ability for these structures to give you free units might require that their cost be increased.

Star Wars Man

05-19-2007, 10:44 AM

Quadhelix

05-19-2007, 04:38 PM

I'm thinking of adding a new Special ability to the Scrin called "Meteor Strike". Specs:
Available after "Signal Transmitter" is built
Costs $5000
Recharges in 90 secondsAnd basically what it does is send about 4-5 meteors crashing down to the ground. Cause enormous damage and the Area of Effect is huge. To counter-balance this it will be expensive, available only on the last tier and takes 90 seconds to recharge (The time it takes may change for balance reasons).

In essence, it's a one use Superweapon that can recharge in ~1/5 the time (The Superweapons cost $5000 and I think they have a recharge time of seven minutes). Is that what you want? If so, great. If not...

Edit:

Other Ideas (note: feasibility not guaranteed):

1. Change Scrin unit production dynamic: Since all the Scrin units are teleported onto the battlefield from the mothership and were, theoretically, constructed long before the Scrin ever departed for Earth, it would makes little sense for the Scrin to have to pay for their units. Instead, each Scrin Unit producer (namely, Portals, Warp Spheres, and Gravity Stabilizers) should act somewhat like a Reinforcement Pad from Generals: Zero Hour, bringing a free unit every few minutes, but with Strategy Center logic to allow each unit producer to "call in" a specific unit (i.e., you can command your Portal to warp in Shock Trooper Squads each time it brings in reinforcements).

1b. What I meant by "you can command your Portal to warp in Shock Trooper Squads each time it brings in reinforcements" is that you can give your Portal one command so that whenever it receives reinforcements, those reinforcements are shock troopers. Also, the ability for these structures to give you free units might require that their cost be increased.

1c. This video (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H6IhMdgdFvQ) of the Starcraft 2 demo got me thinking. At about 5:08 into the video, we learn that the Protoss can warp in units anywhere that they control (similar to a C&C Con Yard) on the battlefield, somewhat like the reinforcement powers in Tiberium Wars. With my idea above, what if the Scrin unit producers could be upgraded to place units the same way that structures are placed (For a price, of course, but my current idea is that Scrin units would normally be free). That means that if you place an outpost near the enemy base, you can immediately use your Portal back in the main base to call in ten Shock Trooper squads within five seconds, at the cost of $1500 per squad (Shock Trooper squads originally cost $800, according to CNC3.NET (http://cnc3.net/alienunits.php)). I am slightly worried that such an ability would be overpowered. I also wonder if Tripods and Carriers (and maybe other units) could act as "beacons" around which friendly units could be warped in (i.e., effectively give moving units ground control for placing certain "structures," namely, the units). Feedback?

SgtRicko

05-20-2007, 01:15 PM

Quadhelix

05-20-2007, 09:21 PM

Other Ideas (note: feasibility not guaranteed):

1. Change Scrin unit production dynamic: Since all the Scrin units are teleported onto the battlefield from the mothership and were, theoretically, constructed long before the Scrin ever departed for Earth, it would makes little sense for the Scrin to have to pay for their units. Instead, each Scrin Unit producer (namely, Portals, Warp Spheres, and Gravity Stabilizers) should act somewhat like a Reinforcement Pad from Generals: Zero Hour, bringing a free unit every few minutes, but with Strategy Center logic to allow each unit producer to "call in" a specific unit (i.e., you can command your Portal to warp in Shock Trooper Squads each time it brings in reinforcements).

2. Give Nod subterranean units, if possible.

3. Less Anti-Stealth. Maybe make it so that the "Anti-Stealth Units" (Pitbull, Attack Bike, and Seeker) can detect only the presence of cloaked units and buildings, not their actual location. Maybe give each side a "Mobile Sensor Array" type of unit that can reveal the location of cloaked buildings, but not units, of which it can detect only the presence. Also, the "Disruption Tower" should at the very least have an upgrade allowing it to cloak itself.

4. An idea I had based on the status of the real army (at least according to an article in either Popular Science of Popular Mechanics) is to have each human infantry squad (with some exceptions, such as Zone Troopers, Sniper Teams, Shadow Troopers, Black Hand Troopers, and Scrin infantry in general) come equipped with a "Commander" or "Communications Soldier." If a squads Commander is killed, orders must be relayed to that squad via nearby squads. If a squad isolated from the rest of the Player's forces loses its Commander, the Player loses all control of that squad. Commanders are only slightly stronger that a single Rifleman or Militant, and obviously cost less than the squad as a whole when trained independently of a squad (which you would do to replace lost squad Commanders).
To continue my previous list:

5. Reduce Shadow Team ($800) to one unit, a Shadow Operative, and give him the abilities of the GLA Saboteur ($800) from Zero Hour and Hijacker ($400) from vanilla Generals. I am unsure whether or not a cost increase would appropriate (probably, because the original Saboteur was not cloaked and couldn't fly, but the amount stolen from an enemy refinery would have to be increased to compensate for the increased cost).
*Another possibility is to allow the Shadow Operative to switch between Saboteur/Sniper mode and Chameleon Spy/Hijacker mode. As a Saboteur/Sniper, the Shadow Operative is cloaked only when stationary, but can fire while cloaked, and can disable buildings by entering them. In Chameleon Spy/Hijacker mode, the Shadow Operative is cloaked when not using firing, can hijack vehicles, and can enter enemy buildings to give a report on their status (i.e., how much money the enemy has based on his Refinery, how much power based on his power plant, etc.). To keep people from using the Chameleon mode to sneak into the enemy base before switching to Saboteur mode, Shadow Operatives must return to a Secret Shrine to make the transition between modes.

6. I say again, cheaper Tiberium. In Tiberian Sun, a Titan cost $800 when Harvesters brought back loads of $700: less than one Titan per Harvester load. In Tiberium Wars, a Predator Tank costs $1100 when Harvesters bring back $2,400 per load: more than two Predator Tanks each Harvester load. Mammoth Tanks now cost little more than one Harvester load. Tiberium value should be cut in third (and maybe reduce unit cost slightly, i.e., $900 Predator Tank, while increasing build times: NO HORDES!!!!!!).

7. Rename the Flamethrower infantry to "Purifier Squad" or something similar and make the Black Hand Troopers a covert ops unit: cloaked when not firing, can swim, and can climb cliffs and walls. Possible armaments (pick one) include laser rifles, Tiberium gas grenades, plasma cannon, etc. They might "inherit" the Shadow Team's demo charge ability if the Shadow Operative is used in the Shadow Teams' place.

Edit:

1b. What I meant by "you can command your Portal to warp in Shock Trooper Squads each time it brings in reinforcements" is that you can give your Portal one command so that whenever it receives reinforcements, those reinforcements are shock troopers. Also, the ability for these structures to give you free units might require that their cost be increased.

1c. This video (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H6IhMdgdFvQ) of the Starcraft 2 demo got me thinking. At about 5:08 into the video, we learn that the Protoss can warp in units anywhere that they control (similar to a C&C Con Yard) on the battlefield, somewhat like the reinforcement powers in Tiberium Wars. With my idea above, what if the Scrin unit producers could be upgraded to place units the same way that structures are placed (For a price, of course, but my current idea is that Scrin units would normally be free). That means that if you place an outpost near the enemy base, you can immediately use your Portal back in the main base to call in ten Shock Trooper squads within five seconds, at the cost of $1500 per squad (Shock Trooper squads originally cost $800, according to CNC3.NET (http://cnc3.net/alienunits.php)). I am slightly worried that such an ability would be overpowered. I also wonder if Tripods and Carriers (and maybe other units) could act as "beacons" around which friendly units could be warped in (i.e., effectively give moving units ground control for placing certain "structures," namely, the units). Feedback?

8. Map-wide Ion Storms that kill flying air units and trap hover units. This would require modification to the Nod Venom (unless, of course, Nod has given Venoms special equipment that allows them to stay in flight during an Ion Storm). Scrin air units would obviously get the same benefits as from a Storm Column's or Planetary Assault Carrier's Ion Storm.

9. GDI Jumpjet Infantry should make a comeback. They could behave in one of several manners:

a. Like non-stealth Shadow Teams that can fire while in flight (of course, with different weapons and no demo charges). This would offer the air unit ability of the original JJI, but allowing stationary units to remain in flight or keep mobile units on the ground (useful if air-kill Ion Storms make a return).

b. Perhaps more as hover infantry than as air units (they would, of course, share the Zone Trooper's jump jet ability, for clearing walls and cliffs), floating along the battlefield, over large expanses of water, out of reach of Tiberium's toxic fumes. If their hover ability is taken out (by, say, an EMP or Ion Storm) they could still walk, but would be very slow, plus vulnerable to Tiberium.

10. Not my idea, but what about the building recommended in this thread (http://forums.revora.net/index.php?showtopic=49142) on CNC3.net. In essence, it is a like a Rig/Surveyor in that it is built as a unit and deployed on the battlefield, leaning more toward a Surveyor in nature because it takes time to deploy and cannot be undeployed. The structure acts as bunker for tanks (which cannot fire out) and is strong enough to take even a superweapon strike, although a ground attack might have more success.

I'm never going to get feedback on any of these ideas, am I?:\

SgtRicko

05-21-2007, 01:49 AM

8. Map-wide Ion Storms that kill flying air units and trap hover units. This would require modification to the Nod Venom (unless, of course, Nod has given Venoms special equipment that allows them to stay in flight during an Ion Storm). Scrin air units would obviously get the same benefits as from a Storm Column's or Planetary Assault Carrier's Ion Storm.

The problem with this is that it would severly tip the balance in favor of the Scrin whenever the storm comes around, and GDI would be screwed until the Storm passes.

Besides, I'm pretty certain that both Nod and GDI found a way to negate the the effects of an Ion Storm, as evidenced by the fact that they can still ferry in reinforcements and such into Italy, despite the fact that the whole peninsula was a tiberium hell with nasty weather at all times.

Star Wars Man

05-21-2007, 09:17 AM

Or there could be an upgrade at, say, GDI's Airfield where it bolts onto all aircraft "lightning rods", persay, and that would be able to control the lightning for soem time. It wouldn't be able to catch all the bolts though, and some may get in. (This of course being for balance reasons).

Cylon Crusader

05-22-2007, 07:32 AM

-Aerial transports can be built and can carry either 10 infantry squads or 5 vehicles but can only carry one avtar/mammoth/anihilator tripod.

-New faction:The Forgotten.Abandoned people living in Red and Yellow Zones combining together to take the fight to the GDI, Nod and Scrin as well as Mutants. Basically they combine technologies from GDI and Nod to make their own units e.x: Strapping a juggernauts top onto a captured avatar mech giving it a laser cannon and the juggernauts 2 artillery cannons. I will give more on this a little ater cuz im in school right now, I finnaly got my laptop back from the repair shop over the weekend so I will give more info a little later.

Daishi

05-22-2007, 08:13 AM

I actually theorized a faction for the Tiberium Universe myself. TN/TL had everything from Tecumseh walkers for long range to Sunshine Tanks for short-range. And they had a colossal amphibious MCV, called the Mjollnir. Their hero unit was a mechanized Brute. ^^

Quadhelix

05-23-2007, 08:07 PM

The problem with this is that it would severly tip the balance in favor of the Scrin whenever the storm comes around, and GDI would be screwed until the Storm passes.

Besides, I'm pretty certain that both Nod and GDI found a way to negate the the effects of an Ion Storm, as evidenced by the fact that they can still ferry in reinforcements and such into Italy, despite the fact that the whole peninsula was a tiberium hell with nasty weather at all times.

First, I would like to thank you for actually responding to one of my suggestions. You have an excellent point.

If the Ion Storm did not disable GDI and Nod Aircraft, would it still unbalance the game, given that the Scrin can produce their own Ion Storms? Also, what about replacing the Scrin's Rift Generator with an Ion Storm Generator that creates a map wide Ion Storm for 15-20 seconds, as well as a slightly more concentrated storm (somewhat like RA2's Weather Storm) at the target site?

To Continue my idea list (the earlier entries in my list can be found at the following post)
:\

11. For balance reasons, weaken the highest tech unit of each faction. Mammoth Tanks should be too slow to use as an offensive unit, reserved to base defense duties. The Avatars should have about the same firepower (damage per shot, rate of fire, "charging" time) as an Obelisk of Light and less armor/"health." Annihilators should be able to mow through tanks (and aircraft?), but be nigh helpless against concentrated infantry attack.

12. "Full sized" Rocket Squads (5-6 men), cheaper infantry (Riflemen: $150, Militants: $100, Rockets: $250), and weaker anti-infantry defenses.

13. Alter Beam Cannon. A Beam Cannon should drain about 5% of any given vehicle's full health for every second that it attacks, i.e., a Beam Cannon should be able to destroy any vehicular target in twenty seconds. For buildings, the damage should be 1% per second. While Beam Cannon can kill most infantry in one hit (with the possible exception of Zone Trooper and Shock Troopers), its low rate of fire combined with the large numbers of infantry (it takes a Beam Cannon six shots to kill one Rifleman Squad) that can be mustered against a single target makes the Beam Cannon a poor anti-infantry weapon.

14. Give Scrin walkers (i.e., the Gun Walkers and Corrupters, NOT Annihilators) the ability to scale cliffs. Perhaps provide the Scrin with a Centipede (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:Centipede.jpg) Transport Walker capable of climbing cliffs and of carrying Seekers or Devourer Tanks on its back.

Cylon Crusader

05-24-2007, 08:00 AM

Daishi

05-24-2007, 08:16 AM

7. Rename the Flamethrower infantry to "Purifier Squad" or something similar and make the Black Hand Troopers a covert ops unit: cloaked when not firing, can swim, and can climb cliffs and walls. Possible armaments (pick one) include laser rifles, Tiberium gas grenades, plasma cannon, etc. They might "inherit" the Shadow Team's demo charge ability if the Shadow Operative is used in the Shadow Teams' place.
Nope. Black Hand plz.

8. Map-wide Ion Storms that kill flying air units and trap hover units. This would require modification to the Nod Venom (unless, of course, Nod has given Venoms special equipment that allows them to stay in flight during an Ion Storm). Scrin air units would obviously get the same benefits as from a Storm Column's or Planetary Assault Carrier's Ion Storm.
No, I don't agree with this. If anything, it could be a very expenive Scrin support power, even a secondary superweapon.

9. GDI Jumpjet Infantry should make a comeback. They could behave in one of several manners:

a. Like non-stealth Shadow Teams that can fire while in flight (of course, with different weapons and no demo charges). This would offer the air unit ability of the original JJI, but allowing stationary units to remain in flight or keep mobile units on the ground (useful if air-kill Ion Storms make a return).b. Perhaps more as hover infantry than as air units (they would, of course, share the Zone Trooper's jump jet ability, for clearing walls and cliffs), floating along the battlefield, over large expanses of water, out of reach of Tiberium's toxic fumes. If their hover ability is taken out (by, say, an EMP or Ion Storm) they could still walk, but would be very slow, plus vulnerable to Tiberium.
I don't agree with this too much. It'd get complicated.
10. Not my idea, but what about the building recommended in this thread (http://forums.revora.net/index.php?showtopic=49142) on CNC3.net. In essence, it is a like a Rig/Surveyor in that it is built as a unit and deployed on the battlefield, leaning more toward a Surveyor in nature because it takes time to deploy and cannot be undeployed. The structure acts as bunker for tanks (which cannot fire out) and is strong enough to take even a superweapon strike, although a ground attack might have more success.

Vehicle bunker sounds interesting, especially for GDI, but superweapon strikes tend to hit really hard and fast :\

11. For balance reasons, weaken the highest tech unit of each faction. Mammoth Tanks should be too slow to use as an offensive unit, reserved to base defense duties. The Avatars should have about the same firepower (damage per shot, rate of fire, "charging" time) as an Obelisk of Light and less armor/"health." Annihilators should be able to mow through tanks (and aircraft?), but be nigh helpless against concentrated infantry attack.
Won't help balance at all, and will make the tech centers less worth it, but sure.

12. "Full sized" Rocket Squads (5-6 men), cheaper infantry (Riflemen: $150, Militants: $100, Rockets: $250), and weaker anti-infantry defenses.Full-sized rocket squads will be too powerful imo, especially if you don't increase their price.

13. Alter Beam Cannon. A Beam Cannon should drain about 5% of any given vehicle's full health for every second that it attacks, i.e., a Beam Cannon should be able to destroy any vehicular target in twenty seconds. For buildings, the damage should be 1% per second. While Beam Cannon can kill most infantry in one hit (with the possible exception of Zone Trooper and Shock Troopers), its low rate of fire combined with the large numbers of infantry (it takes a Beam Cannon six shots to kill one Rifleman Squad) that can be mustered against a single target makes the Beam Cannon a poor anti-infantry weapon.

It's a siege weapon for attacking bases. It doesn't necessarily need to be good against infantry when Nod has enough anti-infantry solutions.

14. Give Scrin walkers (i.e., the Gun Walkers and Corrupters, NOT Annihilators) the ability to scale cliffs. Perhaps provide the Scrin with a Centipede (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:Centipede.jpg) Transport Walker capable of climbing cliffs and of carrying Seekers or Devourer Tanks on its back.

Walkers and Corrupters scaling cliffs? Very good idea! Hope we can get it to work.

SgtRicko

05-24-2007, 08:35 AM

First, I would like to thank you for actually responding to one of my suggestions. You have an excellent point.

Thanks!!!:D

If the Ion Storm did not disable GDI and Nod Aircraft, would it still unbalance the game, given that the Scrin can produce their own Ion Storms? Also, what about replacing the Scrin's Rift Generator with an Ion Storm Generator that creates a map wide Ion Storm for 15-20 seconds, as well as a slightly more concentrated storm (somewhat like RA2's Weather Storm) at the target site?

I think the best way to make the Ion Storm into an ability would be to link it to something like the Signal Transmitter (you know, the thing that calls in the mothership and stuff) and turn it into a small, yet concentrated storm. It would be the size of, say, maybe half the screen, and it's major use will be to prevent air units (it would still strike at ground units, but not as viciously as it would anything airborne) from going near the area it's at for a time until it fades away. It should last for about 20-30 seconds, so as not to make it so powerful to the point where it becomes a SW of it's own.

11. For balance reasons, weaken the highest tech unit of each faction. Mammoth Tanks should be too slow to use as an offensive unit, reserved to base defense duties. The Avatars should have about the same firepower (damage per shot, rate of fire, "charging" time) as an Obelisk of Light and less armor/"health." Annihilators should be able to mow through tanks (and aircraft?), but be nigh helpless against concentrated infantry attack.

I think the Mammies and Tripods are fine as is. As for the avatar... well, I'm thinking that relegating it into some sort of command unit (in addition to all the abilities it already has) would be a good idea. It'll act like the avenger from ZH: it will use a laser designator ability to focus all the units in it's group to concentrate on a single target, while also slightly increasing the damage done by everybody on the designated target as well.

12. "Full sized" Rocket Squads (5-6 men), cheaper infantry (Riflemen: $150, Militants: $100, Rockets: $250), and weaker anti-infantry defenses.

Missile squads are small so as to be wimpy vs inf units, yet hard to hit for tanks. Also, the upcoming patch is going to do a lot to help the infantry, so I'll wait until it comes out to pass out judgement.

13. Alter Beam Cannon. A Beam Cannon should drain about 5% of any given vehicle's full health for every second that it attacks, i.e., a Beam Cannon should be able to destroy any vehicular target in twenty seconds. For buildings, the damage should be 1% per second. While Beam Cannon can kill most infantry in one hit (with the possible exception of Zone Trooper and Shock Troopers), its low rate of fire combined with the large numbers of infantry (it takes a Beam Cannon six shots to kill one Rifleman Squad) that can be mustered against a single target makes the Beam Cannon a poor anti-infantry weapon.

You need to spam beam cannons and focus them on a single target in order to see their true power. Try it; you'll REALLY like the results when you have 5-6 of those babies on a single target!:evil:

14. Give Scrin walkers (i.e., the Gun Walkers and Corrupters, NOT Annihilators) the ability to scale cliffs.

Hey, not a bad idea!:chin:

Perhaps provide the Scrin with a Centipede (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:Centipede.jpg) Transport Walker capable of climbing cliffs and of carrying Seekers or Devourer Tanks on its back.

STOP PLAYING SUPCOM, YOU UNFAITHFUL HERETIC!!!!:rant: :gnasher:

Change Scrin unit production dynamic: Since all the Scrin units are teleported onto the battlefield from the mothership and were, theoretically, constructed long before the Scrin ever departed for Earth, it would makes little sense for the Scrin to have to pay for their units. Instead, each Scrin Unit producer (namely, Portals, Warp Spheres, and Gravity Stabilizers) should act somewhat like a Reinforcement Pad from Generals: Zero Hour, bringing a free unit every few minutes, but with Strategy Center logic to allow each unit producer to "call in" a specific unit (i.e., you can command your Portal to warp in Shock Trooper Squads each time it brings in reinforcements).

Good God, if you were to EVER apply that change to a hard steamroller AI (God FORBID Bruta!), you'd never be able to beat it!!! :eek:
I think the scrin build style is plenty fine enough.

4. An idea I had based on the status of the real army (at least according to an article in either Popular Science of Popular Mechanics) is to have each human infantry squad (with some exceptions, such as Zone Troopers, Sniper Teams, Shadow Troopers, Black Hand Troopers, and Scrin infantry in general) come equipped with a "Commander" or "Communications Soldier." If a squads Commander is killed, orders must be relayed to that squad via nearby squads. If a squad isolated from the rest of the Player's forces loses its Commander, the Player loses all control of that squad. Commanders are only slightly stronger that a single Rifleman or Militant, and obviously cost less than the squad as a whole when trained independently of a squad (which you would do to replace lost squad Commanders).

too much micro would be involved, and it would make the GDI sniper team FAR too powerful (imagine a sniper hidden in a hard-to-reach area that ends up picking off all of the officers of a large infantry force... not cool man, NOT cool!!!:dead: ) And besides, Nod has something similar to this in the forum of the Confessor upgrade, which also adds an additional officer unit to your militia, rocket troops, and Black Hand flamer troops. (BTW, just in case if you don't know, groups with Confessors inside them are slightly better than others without them)

3. Less Anti-Stealth. Maybe make it so that the "Anti-Stealth Units" (Pitbull, Attack Bike, and Seeker) can detect only the presence of cloaked units and buildings, not their actual location. Maybe give each side a "Mobile Sensor Array" type of unit that can reveal the location of cloaked buildings, but not units, of which it can detect only the presence. Also, the "Disruption Tower" should at the very least have an upgrade allowing it to cloak itself.

Not wise... it would make it damn near impossible to make scouting parties if you did this. Furthermore, it would make Nod's disruptor field too difficult to counter (just imagine trying to get a mobile sensor array close to a Nod base you can't see without losing it to a Vertigo or hidden obelisk!:dead:

6. I say again, cheaper Tiberium. In Tiberian Sun, a Titan cost $800 when Harvesters brought back loads of $700: less than one Titan per Harvester load. In Tiberium Wars, a Predator Tank costs $1100 when Harvesters bring back $2,400 per load: more than two Predator Tanks each Harvester load. Mammoth Tanks now cost little more than one Harvester load. Tiberium value should be cut in third (and maybe reduce unit cost slightly, i.e., $900 Predator Tank, while increasing build times: NO HORDES!!!!!!).

I'm 50/50 on this one. While I do agree that the game goes too fast at times due to the insane levels of Tiberium collection, it also helps to get pass some of the slower moments in the game. Also, it helps to compensate for the fact that a lot of the units in the game are pretty damn expensive (i.e. the PACs, Tripods, Juggernauts, etc.)

I would reply to more of your ideas, but they're just too many to read.:freek:

Maybe I'll add some more suggestions later.;)

Quadhelix

05-24-2007, 09:39 PM

Nope. Black Hand plz.

Please clarify?

No, I don't agree with this. If anything, it could be a very expenive Scrin support power, even a secondary superweapon.

Yeah, SgtRicko already pointed out that such a random event would seriously unbalance the game. I still think that random, map-wide Ion Storms on (re: Red Zone) certain maps would benefit the atmosphere

NOT a Superweapon or Ability: New random, map-wide Ion Storms should be quick (5-10 seconds), but brutal (map-wide EMP effects; instant death of all airborne aircraft, save shielded PACs and Devastators, which still suffer heavy hull damage; lightning strikes kill or critically damage [over 75% damage] any vehicle, even a Mammoth or Tripod, in one direct hit). In short, nobody is safe from the random Ion Storms. (This idea is probably still bad, I'll let you guys decide that)

I don't agree with this too much. It'd get complicated.

I'm not sure if we're communicating about the JJI. I meant that either JJI would always behave in manner (a) or always in manner (b). (Edit: In other words, the player is not able to switch between the two "modes")

Vehicle bunker sounds interesting, especially for GDI, but superweapon strikes tend to hit really hard and fast

The main idea is that the player would keep reserve units in the Bunker (for example, a spare MCV) so if a superweapon destroys most of the base, the player can still rebuild.

Won't help balance at all, and will make the tech centers less worth it, but sure

Sorry, bad wording. This idea was inspired by the general complaint that, in the late game, nobody builds anything but Mammoths, Avatars, and Annihilators. I hope that by weakening these units, players will be forces to vary their unit mix.

Full-sized rocket squads will be too powerful imo, especially if you don't increase their price.

Actually, with the prices that I gave, their price was increased relative to the other basic infantry. Also, it might be a good idea to reduce their firepower and health while increasing their numbers. The main reason that i suggested this is because I have no idea why an APC can hold 5-6 Riflemen but only 2 Rocketmen. (Perhaps, instead of adding four more rocketmen, add one rocketman and three "support soldiers," who carry ammo for the rocketmen)

It's a siege weapon for attacking bases. It doesn't necessarily need to be good against infantry when Nod has enough anti-infantry solutions.

Sorry, my point was that the new design should be [I]bad against infantry (That's one of the reasons that I wanted to have "full sized" Rocket Squads).

Walkers and Corrupters scaling cliffs? Very good idea! Hope we can get it to work.

Thanks.

I think the Mammies and Tripods are fine as is. As for the avatar... well, I'm thinking that relegating it into some sort of command unit (in addition to all the abilities it already has) would be a good idea. It'll act like the avenger from ZH: it will use a laser designator ability to focus all the units in it's group to concentrate on a single target, while also slightly increasing the damage done by everybody on the designated target as well.

Interesting idea.

It and my idea are not incompatible; in fact, they compliment each other. If your "Avenger" Avatars were incapable of increasing the attack power of other Avatars and were simultaneously weaker than Avatars were in the un-modded Tiberium Wars, then players would be forced to use Avatars mixed in with other units in order to really get much use out of their WarMechs.

STOP PLAYING SUPCOM, YOU UNFAITHFUL HERETIC!!!!:rant: :gnasher:

:dismay: You mean someone already did something like that? (I've never played Supreme Commander. Ever. Now Starcraft, on he other hand...)

I had simply figured that if Gun Walkers and Corrupters could scale cliffs, then the Seekers and Devourer Tanks were going to need some type of transport in order to keep up.

(Edit: Another idea related to the Centipede is that it could fold up its legs and hover, allowing it to carry Gun Walkers and Corrupters over water [Can Seekers and Devourer Tanks move over water?])

Good God, if you were to EVER apply that change to a hard steamroller AI (God FORBID Bruta!), you'd [I]never be able to beat it!!! :eek:
I think the scrin build style is plenty fine enough.

Really, it all depends on how long the deploy time is. If a Scrin player has to wait two minutes just to get a pack of Buzzers, from a Portal that costs $1500, then it would be extremely difficult for him/her/it to accumulate a large force.

A fifteen minute (Edit: half-hour) waiting time between Planetary Assault Carriers does not seem unreasonable to me.

too much micro would be involved

I sort of had the idea that unless the Commander was specifically targeted, he would be the last unit in a squad to fall under attack, both because his armor is better and because his weapon is weaker. Also, squads that lost their Commander would probably return to base by default, unless in the middle of a massive attack or something like that, so they could easily be ordered around by the player once they make it back to base.

and it would make the GDI sniper team FAR too powerful (imagine a sniper hidden in a hard-to-reach area that ends up picking off all of the officers of a large infantry force... not cool man, NOT cool!!!:dead: )

I feel that the Sniper is not a very "GDI" style unit anyway. (Edit: Also, Squad Commanders' armor should be heavy enough that they can survive 2-3 hits from a sniper rifle)

Not wise... it would make it damn near impossible to make scouting parties if you did this. Furthermore, it would make Nod's disruptor field too difficult to counter (just imagine trying to get a mobile sensor array close to a Nod base you can't see without losing it to a Vertigo or hidden obelisk!:dead:

MSAs would have very long range, as they did in Tiberian Sun. The main difference is that they cannot detect the exact location of units. So no problem with the Obelisks. As for the Vertigo, an MSA would cost about $800, less than half the cost of a Vertigo, so with some good AA, using Vertigoes to kill MSAs becomes a losing proposition.

My main problem is that TS MSAs make Stealth Tanks worse than useless, as one MSA could protect the whole base. At the same time, MSAs were absolutely essential to destroying a cloaked base. Also, as many have pointed out, the Disruption Tower is, in many ways, as step back for Nod, as it cannot cloak itself, something that the Stealth Generators of nearly thirty years previous could do. Thus, I figured that the best way to resolve this apparent contradiction is to give "Stealth Towers" a self upgrade that requires a Tech Center, or even a Temple of Nod, to cloak themselves, much like the upgrades on the Power Plants of each side.

Yes, the idea needs serious balancing.

I'm 50/50 on this one. While I do agree that the game goes too fast at times due to the insane levels of Tiberium collection, it also helps to get pass some of the slower moments in the game. Also, it helps to compensate for the fact that a lot of the units in the game are pretty damn expensive (i.e. the PACs, Tripods, Juggernauts, etc.)

As were Mammoth Tanks, the Mammoth Mk. II, Battle Fortresses, etc.

I would reply to more of your ideas, but they're just too many to read.:freek:

Thank you for taking what time you did. It really helps to know what ideas work and which ones do not.

Cylon Crusader

05-25-2007, 07:37 AM

Continuing my list on the new faction-The Forgotten.

Units:

Artillery: Juggernaut and avatar warmech combined into one (juggernauts top hooked onto avatars main body).Has avatars 1 laser cannon and 2 out of 3 juggernaut artillery cannon and has the ability to crush squads and tanks when it steps on them.Cost: 1950, called Goliath heavy artillery.

Tanks: Have 1 type of tank called rhino, upgraded from old tanks from late 20th and early 21st century.Has one 120mm cannon and 2 machineguns for AA and infantry, an upgrade can be bought for 700 credits giving the tank a rocket pod that can fire 2 rockets.

Infantry: Shcoker asault squad has 10 riflemen, 5 rocket troopers, 6 grenadiers and 3 snipers and cost 1000 credits.Upgrade can be bought to give the squad a leader which increases hp, gives health when standing still and gives the entire squad a range and damage bonus. Squad leader upgrade costs 2500 credits.

Aircraft: Guess what the Crusader is back but this time it has 2 rocket pods each firing 2 rockets and it neeeds to come back to airstrip to rearm the rockets, has 30 rockets for the rocket pods, also has 1 firehawk bomb and 2 machine guns which can be upgraded to lasers.

more on this later.

The Crusader is basically an old Mig-23 mixed up with parts from nods venom and GDI's Orca. Cost:2500 Limit:12

Engineer: Can booby trap neutral and your own buildings and can detect stealth (over a very short radius though).Can repair buildings and has 5% more armour than regular engineers but has a 2% speed reduction than regular engineers.Cost:550

Bogey: Fast attack vehicle, can store 1 engineer who can repair the vehicle to 50% health.Bogey has a machine gun which can swivel 360 degrees but cant be upgraded to laser.In addition if there is an engineer sitting in the forward side seat, he can fire a small 7.25mm forward firing machinegun which can be upgraded to small laser.Cost:700

Rhno tank costs 1300.

more on this later

avalon

05-25-2007, 07:52 AM

the only thing i would add to CNC3... BATTLESHIPS!!! floating ones like in the seed warzone! now that would be F****** awsome,
and increase tib harvesting but make units/buildings go up in price as u build

Quadhelix

05-25-2007, 08:45 AM

Artillery: Juggernaut and avatar warmech combined into one (juggernauts top hooked onto avatars main body).Has avatars 1 laser cannon and 2 out of 3 juggernaut artillery cannon and has the ability to crush squads and tanks when it steps on them.Cost: 1950, called Goliath heavy artillery.

Seems a little too high-tech for this faction. Why not give them normal artillery (which would also have the advantage of allowing you to recycle the Inferno Cannon or Nuke Cannon model from Generals).

Tanks: Have 1 type of tank called rhino, upgraded from old tanks from late 20th and early 21st century.Has one 120mm cannon and 2 machineguns for AA and infantry, an upgrade can be bought for 700 credits giving the tank a rocket pod that can fire 2 rockets.

Too useful. Get rid of the machine guns.

Infantry: Shcoker asault squad has 10 riflemen, 5 rocket troopers, 6 grenadiers and 3 snipers and cost 1000 credits.Upgrade can be bought to give the squad a leader which increases hp, gives health when standing still and gives the entire squad a range and damage bonus. Squad leader upgrade costs 2500 credits.

That squad has 24 soldiers, three times the number in a normal squad. Size needs to be reduced. Also, Grenadiers and Snipers are GDI units.

Aircraft: Guess what the Crusader is back but this time it has 2 rocket pods each firing 2 rockets and it neeeds to come back to airstrip to rearm the rockets, has 30 rockets for the rocket pods, also has 1 firehawk bomb and 2 machine guns which can be upgraded to lasers.

Same problem as before: one unit with too many functions. Also, lasers are generally a Nod technology. It should probably have a "switch armaments" function like the Firehawk's so that it could carry either 4 anti-tank/anti-air missiles or one anti-structure bomb.

The Crusader is basically an old Mig-23 mixed up with parts from nods venom and GDI's Orca. Cost:2500 Limit:12

Seems a little expensive for what amounts to flying scrap. Also, perhaps the parts should come from Tiberian Sun GDI Orca Fighters and Nod Harpies to fit the whole "scavenger army" theme.

Engineer: Can booby trap neutral and your own buildings and can detect stealth (over a very short radius though).Can repair buildings and has 5% more armour than regular engineers but has a 2% speed reduction than regular engineers.Cost:550

Interesting idea.

Bogey: Fast attack vehicle, can store 1 engineer who can repair the vehicle to 50% health.Bogey has a machine gun which can swivel 360 degrees but cant be upgraded to laser.In addition if there is an engineer sitting in the forward side seat, he can fire a small 7.25mm forward firing machinegun which can be upgraded to small laser.Cost:700

Good idea with the Engineer. Price Check: your "Bogey" unit costs the same as a GDI Pitbull or APC ($700), slightly more than a Nod Attack Bike ($600), and nearly twice a Nod Raider Buggy ($400). Also, Laser technology is, again, a Nod trademark.

Rhno tank costs 1300.

Seems a little expensive for a scrap tank (more expensive than the $1100 GDI Predator or $800 Nod Scorpion).

Edit:
MSAs would have very long range, as they did in Tiberian Sun. The main difference is that they cannot detect the exact location of units. So no problem with the Obelisks. As for the Vertigo, an MSA would cost about $800, less than half the cost of a Vertigo, so with some good AA, using Vertigoes to kill MSAs becomes a losing proposition.

My main problem is that TS MSAs make Stealth Tanks worse than useless, as one MSA could protect the whole base. At the same time, MSAs were absolutely essential to destroying a cloaked base. Also, as many have pointed out, the Disruption Tower is, in many ways, as step back for Nod, as it cannot cloak itself, something that the Stealth Generators of nearly thirty years previous could do. Thus, I figured that the best way to resolve this apparent contradiction is to give "Stealth Towers" a self upgrade that requires a Tech Center, or even a Temple of Nod, to cloak themselves, much like the upgrades on the Power Plants of each side.

Yes, the idea needs serious balancing.

I may have solved my own problem: Make the Stealth Tank, and the Stealth Tank only, "immune" to detectors (i.e., detectors can detect the Stealth Tank's presence, but not its location or how many Stealth Tanks are in the area). All other cloaked units can be pinpointed by detectors.

Edit 2:

15. Firestorm Generators and Firestorm Walls. When active, the new Firestorm system should be able to provide special protection, such as quicker recovery from EMP, to units inside its walls. The following "image" (diagram? doodle?) shows where units would receive said "special protections":

http://img461.imageshack.us/img461/5917/newfirestormiq9.png

As the following graphic visualizes, Firestorm "fields" can extent between adjacent semi-enclosed areas, although wall-less Firestorm protection does have a maximum range (either a hard maximum, like a number, or a "soft" maximum, which can be extended by good base design).

http://img73.imageshack.us/img73/73/newfirestorm2kw8.png

16. The damage done by Sonic Emitters should be proportional to the number of enemies within its range of fire (take that, tank spammers:D). In other words, while a Sonic Emitter might have difficulty with a single tank, a large assault would be dispatched with ease. (Note: this would need SERIOUS balancing)

Cylon Crusader

05-25-2007, 01:10 PM

Seems a little too high-tech for this faction. Why not give them normal artillery (which would also have the advantage of allowing you to recycle the Inferno Cannon or Nuke Cannon model from Generals).

Too useful. Get rid of the machine guns.

That squad has 24 soldiers, three times the number in a normal squad. Size needs to be reduced. Also, Grenadiers and Snipers are GDI units.

Same problem as before: one unit with too many functions. Also, lasers are generally a Nod technology. It should probably have a "switch armaments" function like the Firehawk's so that it could carry either 4 anti-tank/anti-air missiles or one anti-structure bomb.

Seems a little expensive for what amounts to flying scrap. Also, perhaps the parts should come from Tiberian Sun GDI Orca Fighters and Nod Harpies to fit the whole "scavenger army" theme.

Interesting idea.

Good idea with the Engineer. Price Check: your "Bogey" unit costs the same as a GDI Pitbull or APC ($700), slightly more than a Nod Attack Bike ($600), and nearly twice a Nod Raider Buggy ($400). Also, Laser technology is, again, a Nod trademark.

Seems a little expensive for a scrap tank (more expensive than the $1100 GDI Predator or $800 Nod Scorpion).

Edit:

I may have solved my own problem: Make the Stealth Tank, and the Stealth Tank only, "immune" to detectors (i.e., detectors can detect the Stealth Tank's presence, but not its location or how many Stealth Tanks are in the area). All other cloaked units can be pinpointed by detectors.

Edit 2:

15. Firestorm Generators and Firestorm Walls. When active, the new Firestorm system should be able to provide special protection, such as quicker recovery from EMP, to units inside its walls. The following "image" (diagram? doodle?) shows where units would receive said "special protections":

http://img461.imageshack.us/img461/5917/newfirestormiq9.png

As the following graphic visualizes, Firestorm "fields" can extent between adjacent semi-enclosed areas, although wall-less Firestorm protection does have a maximum range (either a hard maximum, like a number, or a "soft" maximum, which can be extended by good base design).

http://img73.imageshack.us/img73/73/newfirestorm2kw8.png

16. The damage done by Sonic Emitters should be proportional to the number of enemies within its range of fire (take that, tank spammers:D). In other words, while a Sonic Emitter might have difficulty with a single tank, a large assault would be dispatched with ease. (Note: this would need SERIOUS balancing)

I agree, would give u pos rep but I cant yet.

Quadhelix

05-25-2007, 09:47 PM

MSAs would have very long range, as they did in Tiberian Sun. The main difference is that they cannot detect the exact location of units. So no problem with the Obelisks. As for the Vertigo, an MSA would cost about $800, less than half the cost of a Vertigo, so with some good AA, using Vertigoes to kill MSAs becomes a losing proposition.

My main problem is that TS MSAs make Stealth Tanks worse than useless, as one MSA could protect the whole base. At the same time, MSAs were absolutely essential to destroying a cloaked base. Also, as many have pointed out, the Disruption Tower is, in many ways, as step back for Nod, as it cannot cloak itself, something that the Stealth Generators of nearly thirty years previous could do. Thus, I figured that the best way to resolve this apparent contradiction is to give "Stealth Towers" a self upgrade that requires a Tech Center, or even a Temple of Nod, to cloak themselves, much like the upgrades on the Power Plants of each side.

Yes, the idea needs serious balancing.

I may have solved my own problem: Make the Stealth Tank, and the Stealth Tank only, "immune" to detectors (i.e., detectors can detect the Stealth Tank's presence, but not its location or how many Stealth Tanks are in the area). All other cloaked units can be pinpointed by detectors.

I've been thinking on how to refine this idea:

http://cnc3.net/images/portraits/NewNodStnk.PNG Stealth Tank

Stealth Tanks are equipped with a new stealth generator that allows them to cloak beyond a Pitbull's/Attack Bike's/Seeker's ability to pinpoint. The detector unit will still sound an alarm if a Stealth Tank is within detection range, but the Stealth Tank cannot be pinpointed until it fires (I am debating whether it should fully decloak to fire or whether its "cloaking strength" should decrease only so much that standard detectors can pinpoint its location).

http://cnc3.net/images/portraits/NewNodDisr.PNG Stealth Tower

Un-upgraded Stealth Towers are functionally identical to the Disruption Towers of Tiberium Wars (save, perhaps, a change in prerequisite to an Operations Center. Maybe). However, once a Tech Lab has been assembled, individual Stealth Towers can be upgraded with the ability to self-cloak.

Upgraded Stealth Towers have one major weakness: if the Stealth Tower's cloaking field comes in contact with an MSA's detection field, the exact location of the Stealth Tower is revealed to the owner of the MSA, much in the same manner that superweapons in RA2 would be revealed to all players.

http://www.cncgeneralsworld.com/generals/zerohour/factions/china/images/listeningoutpost.jpg Mobile Sensor Array (not final image)

Much like their relatives in Tiberian Sun, deployed Mobile Sensor Arrays are capable of detecting stealth units within a large radius. "Normal" stealth units, such as Vertigo Bombers or units within range of a Stealth Tower or under the Cloaking Field Command Power, are easily detected and their exact positions pinpointed for targeting.

However, more advanced stealth technology, such as that deployed on Nod's new Stealth Tank, is too sophisticated for Mobile Sensor Arrays to determine the enemy's exact location. In that case, the MSA will sound a short alarm and its area of detection will be "highlighted" by a transparent green grid (or some other visual effect) to let the player know which MSAs have detected Stealth Tanks.

If a Mobile Sensor Array detects a Stealth Tank, the MSA has a special command power that allows it to reveal (for about thirty seconds) the exact location of all Stealth Tanks within its detection range. However, said command power reveals only those Stealth Tanks within detection range of that specific MSA, but prevents all other MSAs from making use of that ability until the ten minute recharge countdown has elapsed.

Images courtesy of CNC3.NET (http://cnc3.net/) and CNC Generals World (http://www.cncgeneralsworld.com/).

SgtRicko

05-26-2007, 01:46 AM

http://cnc3.net/images/portraits/NewNodStnk.PNG Stealth Tank

Stealth Tanks are equipped with a new stealth generator that allows them to cloak beyond a Pitbull's/Attack Bike's/Seeker's ability to pinpoint. The detector unit will still sound an alarm if a Stealth Tank is within detection range, but the Stealth Tank cannot be pinpointed until it fires (I am debating whether it should fully decloak to fire or whether its "cloaking strength" should decrease only so much that standard detectors can pinpoint its location).

It's an okay idea, but you'll be making it near impossible to actually catch and destroy these things unless you're using a small army of pitbulls or seekers (that, or a couple of PACs). If this change were to be implemented, it would be best to decrease the cloaking power of the stealth tank whenever it fires, so as to make it possible to catch.

http://cnc3.net/images/portraits/NewNodDisr.PNG Stealth Tower

Un-upgraded Stealth Towers are functionally identical to the Disruption Towers of Tiberium Wars (save, perhaps, a change in prerequisite to an Operations Center. Maybe). However, once a Tech Lab has been assembled, individual Stealth Towers can be upgraded with the ability to self-cloak.

Upgraded Stealth Towers have one major weakness: if the Stealth Tower's cloaking field comes in contact with an MSA's detection field, the exact location of the Stealth Tower is revealed to the owner of the MSA, much in the same manner that superweapons in RA2 would be revealed to all players.

A good idea. One thing though: if the MSA comes into range of, say, a cloaked Obelisk under the influence of the stealth tower, would it be able to see the Obelisk? Cause if it can't, it might end up being too difficult to effectively counter.

http://www.cncgeneralsworld.com/generals/zerohour/factions/china/images/listeningoutpost.jpg Mobile Sensor Array (not final image)

However, more advanced stealth technology, such as that deployed on Nod's new Stealth Tank, is too sophisticated for Mobile Sensor Arrays to determine the enemy's exact location. In that case, the MSA will sound a short alarm and its area of detection will be "highlighted" by a transparent green grid (or some other visual effect) to let the player know which MSAs have detected Stealth Tanks.

If a Mobile Sensor Array detects a Stealth Tank, the MSA has a special command power that allows it to reveal (for about thirty seconds) the exact location of all Stealth Tanks within its detection range. However, said command power reveals only those Stealth Tanks within detection range of that specific MSA, but prevents all other MSAs from making use of that ability until the ten minute recharge countdown has elapsed.

Not a good idea at all. The timer's too long, and it would be FAR too easy for the enemy to falsely bait you into using this power a the wrong time, then swooping in and completely battering you when you can't properly track them. It would be best if the MSA stood capable of detecting ALL types of stealth at all times, so as to make it possible to fend them off.

Quadhelix

05-26-2007, 07:21 AM

It's an okay idea, but you'll be making it near impossible to actually catch and destroy these things unless you're using a small army of pitbulls or seekers (that, or a couple of PACs). If this change were to be implemented, it would be best to decrease the cloaking power of the stealth tank whenever it fires, so as to make it possible to catch.

I'm having difficulty understanding your second sentence. The way I see it, there are two possible ways for the new Stealth Tank to work (only one of which will be used).a) Although its position cannot be pinpointed while it is not attacking, its presence is detected by all detector units within range. When the Stealth Tank fires, it remains cloaked, however, all detection units can pinpoint the Stealth Tank and attack. In this case, Stealth Tanks that are not firing are almost completely immune to attack (see "Mobile Sensor Array") but give their presence away to detectors, so that the other player will be on guard for when the Stealth Tanks decloak and fire.

b) The Stealth Tank is completely undetectable by anything other than an MSA, which can detect only Stealth Tanks that are moving (The MSA's sensor sweep will still allow stationary Stealth Tanks to be targeted and destroyed). However, Stealth Tanks must decloak completely in order to fire, rendering them vulnerable to any unit stronger than they are.
Either way, the Stealth Tank's cost should be boosted to $1500 (or more) per tank.

(Edit [5/27/2007 2:03 PM]: Also, the Stealth Tank's cloak could be disrupted by the presence of other Stealth Tanks. While a small group [2-3] would not experience any negative effects, large groups of Stealth Tanks would be as easy to detect as other cloaked units [this would probably require a hierarchy of stealth attributes])

A good idea. One thing though: if the MSA comes into range of, say, a cloaked Obelisk under the influence of the stealth tower, would it be able to see the Obelisk? Cause if it can't, it might end up being too difficult to effectively counter.

Yeah, I should have clarified that: an MSA is able to detect and pinpoint any cloaked unit within its detection range with the sole exception of Stealth Tanks (and perhaps, Production Structures hidden by Stealth Towers), which it can still detect, if not actually pinpoint.

Not a good idea at all. The timer's too long, and it would be FAR too easy for the enemy to falsely bait you into using this power a the wrong time, then swooping in and completely battering you when you can't properly track them. It would be best if the MSA stood capable of detecting ALL types of stealth at all times, so as to make it possible to fend them off.

No matter what, MSAs can still detect Stealth Tanks whenever the Stealth Tanks are firing. The "Sensor Pulse" ability is there simply to allow players to clear out Stealth Tanks that are in the players base for scouting, long-term surveillance, etc. or to make a preemptive strike against the Stealth Tanks (MSAs have pretty long sensor ranges, so one or two is enough to provide complete detection of your entire base). Either way, a 3-4 minute recharge does seem far more reasonable and the actual detection time can be reduced to about 15-20 seconds without loss of functionality since once the Stealth Tanks take fire, they decloak completely.

Also, I'm thinking that MSAs should have a missile jammer ability similar to China's ECM Tank in Zero Hour, giving it a use even against armies other than Nod (and handily protecting it from Stealth Tanks, which use missiles as their main weapon).

(Edit 2 [5/27/2007 3:00 PM]: I have attached a chart that outline unit changes for a mod. It's not very good, but it's a start.)

erikm

05-29-2007, 02:25 PM

I find myself wondering if it were possible (and playable) to program/model something like an Ogre Mk 5 (http://www.warehouse23.com/item.html?id=SJG10-0106) (from the Ogre (http://www.sjgames.com/ogre/) board game, vignette (http://www.sjgames.com/ogre/articles/vignette.html)) in C&C3. I'm leaving any licensing issues off the table for this one.

It would almost certainly be a unit for a full conversion and might even be fun to play, but the Ogre side would almost have to be limited to an Ogre yard, a refinery and resource gatherers and a bunch of base defenses. Maybe, just maybe some infantry.

But the effect of the Ogre on the battlefield would be worth it!

Cheers,
ErikM :evil:

Quadhelix

06-02-2007, 08:49 PM

Since nobody read the file that I posted, I guess I'll summarize it and mention some of changes that I made after posting it.
Rocket Squad size nearly tripled but the ROF of individual rocketmen decreased by half. (This applies to both GDI and Nod)

Grenadiers can switch between Anti-Personnel Grenades and Anti-Tank Grenades using Ranger logic from Generals. AP Grenades can be upgraded to clear garrisons while AT Grenades can be upgraded with EMP.

Hover Infantry is a new type of GDI squad infantry that floats over the battlefield. They are armed with heavy machine guns and can use the Zone Troopers' rocket pack ability (but are unable to hover until the ability recharges)

Pitbull ideas taken from here (http://www.ppmsite.com/forum/viewtopic.php?highlight=pitbull&t=14501) (hover upgrade) and here (http://www.ppmsite.com/forum/viewtopic.php?p=164797#164797) (starts with a machine gun and gets a Generals Humvee-style rocket upgrade)

APC and Raider Buggy (and also Gun Walker, actually) loose anti-aircraft. The Laser upgrade for the Raider Buggy may give it AA.

Predator Tanks will also benefit from the Pitbull's rocket upgrade, gaining AA rockets

Mammoth Tanks are significantly slower but have slightly longer range.

Purifier Squads are a new type of Nod Infantry armed with flamethrowers that can be upgraded to a Tiberium weapon.

Shadow Team size is reduce to one "Shadow Operative" who is weaker than a normal shadow team in firepower but maintains the full strength of the demo charge ability and gains the ability to hijack vehicles. I also considered removing their cloaking ability while airborne or while moving on the ground (but not while stationary).

Black Hand Troopers retain their flamethrowers but gain a medium-long ranged laser weapon, a personal cloak, and the ability to scale cliffs and walls.

Tick Tanks are similar to their Tiberian Sun counterparts, acting as a light Medium Tank. While mobile, weaker than a Predator, but while buried, about on par with a Predator, perhaps slightly better.

Beam Cannon no longer do damage based on their numbers but rather based on the health of their target (so they kill most targets in the same amount of time). [Also, they might loose the ability to charge Obelisks of Light, see the entry on Avatars to see why.]

Avatars are equipped with an Obelisk laser that has about 1/2 the Obelisk's ROF. Avatars are equipped with a ZH Avenger-style targeting laser, allowing all units attacking the Avatar's target to fire faster (SgtRicko's idea); the effects of the laser are not cumulative, meaning that there is no benefit from having multiple Avatars attack the same target (except, of course, that you have more lasers of death attacking the target). Finally, Avatars have the ability to "dock" with an Obelisk of light, nearly doubling the Obelisk's firepower, but loosing the ability to move or attack on its own.

Gun Walkers and Corrupters gain the ability to scale cliffs while Seekers and Devourer Tanks gain (retain?) the ability to hover over water.

Annihilator Tripods' guns are replaced with weapons similar to the ECM Tank's beam from Zero Hour.

I find myself wondering if it were possible (and playable) to program/model something like an Ogre Mk 5 (http://www.warehouse23.com/item.html?id=SJG10-0106) (from the Ogre (http://www.sjgames.com/ogre/) board game, vignette (http://www.sjgames.com/ogre/articles/vignette.html)) in C&C3. I'm leaving any licensing issues off the table for this one.

I thought that they already had this in C&C, only it was called a Mammoth Tank.;)

Seriously, I might not understand what you are asking, but it seems to me like the main differences between the Ogre and units in C&C 3 are firepower and appearance. If that is the case, then it would be perfectly possible to program it, and the feasibility of modeling it would depend mostly on the skill of the modeler (somebody please correct me quickly if I am wrong).

2ndLifeAmusement

06-04-2007, 03:59 AM

Well... If I could Mod

This is in brief, what i would do.

Two main changes

Customizable Vehicles and Infantry Squads
Changes to special ability powers or whatever you call them on the leftPlayers should have the ability to customize their vehicles and infantry squads to a certain extent, creating many more playing styles and much more options tactically.

For example take a Mammoth tank. What if a player had the ability to swap the rocket pods, for a scanner for stealth detection – or just leave it out and reduce the cost of the tank?

More options would be available with infantry squads. Different soldiers from a certain squad could be armed differently. The leader of the squad could have a better weapon (Think confessor upgrade). Or maybe, you wanted to arm your riflemen/militants with C4 or grenades of some sort.

These modifications would all have to be in reasonable bounds of course. Meaning that you couldn’t overpower one unit. The changes would have to be very limited. Take the mammoth tank again for an example:

Mammoth Tank

Stats Modification

Armour 10% decrease
Speed 10% increase
ROF no change
Shot Power nochange
Cost 5% increase (Small cost increase to offset advantage gained by modification)

Components Modification

-Dual Cannons
-Two AA guns mounted on side (As opposed to rocket pods)

The schemes for these would be chosen before the game so that the modifications are viewable for everyone.

These following changes would be made to the game to accommodate this.

-Confessor Upgrade now obsolete
-Avatar’s ability to cannibalize own team’s weapons replaced with the ability to take weapons from enemy. This of course has an affect on strength, price and whatnot as it would pose a serious balancing issue.
- Changes needed to be made to upgrades which change/add a weapon such as the pit-bull mortar upgrade.

The second major change would be to the special abilities options – Wormhole, Seed Tiberium etc…
What was quite disappointing about C&C3 is that the special ability system present from Generals had been simplified instead of extended. What would be really good changing this special weapon system to be more of a cross between the Generals Powers in Generals and the Card System in AOEIII.

Players would be able to make schemes of abilities from a huge list to be present in the game. For example say you had a limit of 15 abilities, and there was more than 200 to pick from your faction, you would select abilities that catered to your strategies and playing styles. These abilities would have to be categorised also – One use, Unlimited use, Cost, No Cost, Tech levels and so on… And of course when these abilities after available. What is the most reasonable idea I’ve had so far is to have No cost abilities having to be activated by Points and cost abilities being available whenever.

These changes to the game relating to special abilities

-Some/All infantry squads are dropped by parachutes/drop pods. Somebody, I’m sure has mentioned this before. For God’s Sake this is the most futuristic game in the C&C universe is it not? So why do our damn drop ships have to land before ejecting their troops?!?!?

-Better effects for the explosion of the Tiberium vapour bomb and Catalyst missile.

Just a few ideas for the new special abilities

GDI
-Sonic Resonance Bomb (destroy your enemies’ Tiberium!)
-Overproduction(All war factories work 50% faster for a short period of time)

Nod
-Gap Generator (Create a small black area on the map – would work just like in RA would wear off after a time period)
-Rally (All Hands of Nod produce 4 militant squads each)
-Leaflet Drop(Think Generals)

Scrin
-Devastator Squadron (Spawns 3 devastators at selected location)
-Spike of Corruption (Spawns a spike that distributes Tiberium based slime around its location)

Miscellaneous Changes

-Venoms fire one continuous laser with upgrade that literally slices infantry apart.

-Unarm the GDI APC and give it the ability to transport more units. As well as taking away the ability for units to fire from within it.

-Because of the above change the role of the APC will be replaced by a faster, futuristic hum-vee type vehicle that can only carry one squad.

-Add another walking unit to GDI’s arsenal. Something very titan in role and appearance would be the way to go. C&C3 seems to be lower tech in a lot of places than Tiberian Sun - the titan has been replaced by a conventional tank. The game story’s explanation for the phasing out of walking units was stupid IMHO.
-Reskin or replace the flame tank. It had been obsolete for a whole game and now its back?!? A solution would be giving a reskinned flametank the dozerblades upgrade instead of the scorpion getting it.

-Do something about the beam cannon. Its useless and looks stupid.

-Give Nod a futuristic-generals-style-rocket-buggy type vehicle.

-Missile silos for Nod, required to launch the nuke, catalyst and any new Nod missile. This means that the Temple of Nod is required for the launch as well but not exactly launches the nuke.

-Make the Temple of Nod an essential part of the build tree by making it a tech building.

-Shredder and Laser turrets are built in groups of two not three and are buffed up accordingly. This is to save space.

-Much more upgrades for all factions. It was sad to see that the upgrade system from generals was simplified for C&C3, where should have been extended.

-All anti-amour PreTech base defences are more powerful.

-Give GDI back some Hover vehicles – it seems that the Hover MLRS of TS has been given to Scrin in the form of the Seeker. That’s alright, but GDI needs some sort of vehicle that indicates they’ve actually progressed since the first Tib war.

-Scrin Corrupters are faster and gain the ability to infect a designated area with slime.

-Scrin a given a suicide-type vehicle.

-Nod gets a hijacker

-Fanatics can be upgraded with Tiberium explosives

-Corrupter slime when sprayed upon enemy buildings has a Tiberium crystallisation animation/effect

-New neutral capturable buildings like: Reinforcement Pads
And a building similar in function to the oil refinery in Generals

If anyone likes these ideas feel free to take them and claim them as your own:D

Cylon Crusader

06-04-2007, 02:49 PM

This is continued from my previous post and I am posting this because I completely forgot to add buildings for the GDI, Nod and Scrin.

All Sides:

Walls for GDI and Nod but instead of gates, they use a type of force field that only your units and your allies' units can pass but your enemy needs to destroy their generators to get into your protected area. As for Scrin, they get a type of shield wall which uses an advanced type of shields that are used in GDI and Nod gates but with a mor Scrinish feel.

All races except the Scrin should have a kind of heavy base ship (I have the baseship idea for GDI earlier in this thread somewhere). As for Nod, they get 10 missile turrets that can be used against vehicles as well as air units (It would be good against buildings, aircraft and vehicles but not that effective vs. infantry). I would give it the ability to garrison 20 infantry squads as well as 10 of any other vehicles you desire except for avatars (only garrisoned beamcannons can shoot out from the baseship while in the air as well as missile squads but any garrisoned unit can shoot out from the baseship when it has been landed).The baseship can make low level infantry and vehicles (fanatics, saboteurs and missile troopers and vehicles such as scorpion tanks, attack bikes and buggies). It will also sport 2 aircraft landing pads which can land and repair any of you or your allies' aircraft. You can produce 10 vertigo bombers and 20 venoms. It will be called the Purifier baseship and it will cost 25000 to construct and only one acn be available at all times on the battlefield.

GDI:

Need to get a rocket pod upgrade for AA towers and the upgrade can be purchased individually for each different AA tower.

Nod:

Need a little more bang for their buck in each of their turrets (need to be able to fire faster as well as needs to be able to have more firepower in them).

Scrin:

Nothing for the Scrin now.

I will post more on this in a little while so make like glue and stick around.

Pathogen

06-04-2007, 07:05 PM

Where to begin

1.) Squads: EA what were you thinking. Making a RTS squad based is the worst move possible. Squads are terrible. Single units only!

2.) Pavement. I don't care what anybody says, pavement is awesome.

3.) With pavement there has to be a reason for it besides making units move faster, so subterranean APC and flame tank for nod.

4.) The entire Scin race should be removed. I think they are great fun but they really don't fit into the story. I think they should remain a mystery; the conflict is between man and man, good vs evil, on a dying planet. Throwing aliens into the mix makes it too cliched, classic sci-fi.

5.) Tiberium is a plant with a crystal that protrudes through the ground, but it does have roots underneath. EA made it into just a crystal that spreads by magic. This is incorrect, play Tiberian Dawn; there is a very straightforward cinematic in one of the first missions showing how tiberium roots spread then pop up through the ground as crystals. This would be an easy mod, just replace the current fissure at the center of tib fields with the little tree.

6.) GDI units
-Zone troopers should be removed, they look stupid, as should the commando who is useless and is too generic. They should be replaced with the Ghost Stalker, who is a much better hero unit and has a rail gun. Making zone troopers have rail guns makes the rail gun too commonplace. If just the hero and the mammoth had it it would be special. Rail guns should also be removed off the predator tanks.
-The appearance of snipers should be changed, they look straight out of generals. They should be more high tech.
-Possibly the addition of wolverines and/or titans. Pitbulls or Predators may have to be given up, but they're nothing special anyway.
-Only allow for the building of one mammoth at a time, but amp up its power.
-The juggernaut has to go. It looks really really stupid and unpractical and to top it off it has the quote "I'm the juggernaut!" I almost threw up the first time I heard this.
-The ability for infantry to call for transport should be removed and replaced with the good old fashioned carryall built at the airfield.
-jump jet infantry should be added, maybe to both GDI and NOD
-Some type of hover vehicle should be added, not necessarily an MLRS, maybe something original, but at least something that hovers.

7.) the Ion cannon needs its power to be seriously reduced, as does the nuke. The ion cannon should be one concentrated beam that can take out any building maybe with the exception of the con yard. I think having the nuke in the first place is out of place, but I don't know if its possible to make an all new superweapon. If it's not, then its power should be reduced so it will only take out the weakest of buildings but destroy infantry and vehicles.

8.) NOD units
-Cyborg commando should be the hero unit.
-Where are the cyborgs? they are such a classic NOD unit. Cyborgs should definetly be brought back in place of those stupid shadow team guys. Come on, ninjas? so so so out of place. and when they fly in circles in their little stupid hang gliders? give me a break.
-Saboteurs are in serious need of a new character model. They look like Mysterio from the Spider-man comics. Dome head is lame.
-medics should make an appearance on both sides.
-Artillery should be in there.
-subterranean APC and flame tank as stated above
-make the scorpion tank deployable like the tick tank in Tib Sun
-That ridiculous avatar warmech absolutely has to be removed. Not only does it look more stupid and impractical than anything that ever hit the battlefield, its really not all that good. Its the **** can for the war mech.
-the laser on the front of the helicopter should be replaced with a machine gun. Enough is enough with the lasers already. We get it, NOD loves lasers.

9.) The maps. If theres one thing that EA really sucks at its making maps. Don't get me wrong, I loved generals, but the maps in C&C 3 are the same as the ones in generals. Perfectly symmetrical. Look at maps for Tiberian Sun, they were never ever symmetrical. When the game started it really felt like you were on a battlefield, not some tournament map thing. Also, there should be more civilian/mutant camps sprinkled throughout the map.

10.) Hunter Seeker droids. Therese added a very unique gameplay element and some surprise.

11.)I know lots of people will disagree, but I really think it would be better if all the "generals powers" backup things were removed. It just seems like too much. Maybe one simple one for each team, like a small missile launch or bombing run, but when you don't even need to build troops, you can just wait for all the timers then bombard them and drop infantry pods in their base its just too much. You should have to survive on your wits and strategy, not on backup from base camp.

Now I know this would be one hell of a big mod, and will never get made in entirety, but its not unrealistic to think that over time if lots of people contributed that it could be done piece by piece. It could be 11 separate mods released at different times that would all work together and once they were all complete that game might live up to its predecessors with better graphics.

I realize that most of my ideas are basically direct remakes of Tiberian Sun, but this is for good reason. That was an amazing game that revolutionized RTS and its still my favorite RTS. Come on, what other RTS ever had craters in the ground from powerful explosions that accually changed the face of the battlefield?

Quadhelix

06-04-2007, 10:22 PM

Players should have the ability to customize their vehicles and infantry squads to a certain extent, creating many more playing styles and much more options tactically.

For example take a Mammoth tank. What if a player had the ability to swap the rocket pods, for a scanner for stealth detection – or just leave it out and reduce the cost of the tank?

More options would be available with infantry squads. Different soldiers from a certain squad could be armed differently. The leader of the squad could have a better weapon (Think confessor upgrade). Or maybe, you wanted to arm your riflemen/militants with C4 or grenades of some sort.

These modifications would all have to be in reasonable bounds of course. Meaning that you couldn’t overpower one unit. The changes would have to be very limited. Take the mammoth tank again for an example:

Mammoth Tank

Stats Modification

Armour 10% decrease
Speed 10% increase
ROF no change
Shot Power nochange
Cost 5% increase (Small cost increase to offset advantage gained by modification)

Components Modification

-Dual Cannons
-Two AA guns mounted on side (As opposed to rocket pods)

The schemes for these would be chosen before the game so that the modifications are viewable for everyone.

These following changes would be made to the game to accommodate this.

-Confessor Upgrade now obsolete
-Avatar’s ability to cannibalize own team’s weapons replaced with the ability to take weapons from enemy. This of course has an affect on strength, price and whatnot as it would pose a serious balancing issue.
- Changes needed to be made to upgrades which change/add a weapon such as the pit-bull mortar upgrade.
That would enable/require a huge amount of micromanagement. Therefore, it would have to be done in such a way as to avoid forcing players to spend most of their time customizing individual units. Also, this idea runs the risk of promoting homogeneous armies, consisting mostly of a single type of unit; great care should be taken to make sure that each type of unit is just as important as every other type of unit.

-Confessor Upgrade now obsoleteI fail to see how.

What was quite disappointing about C&C3 is that the special ability system present from Generals had been simplified instead of extended. What would be really good changing this special weapon system to be more of a cross between the Generals Powers in Generals and the Card System in AOEIII.

Players would be able to make schemes of abilities from a huge list to be present in the game. For example say you had a limit of 15 abilities, and there was more than 200 to pick from your faction, you would select abilities that catered to your strategies and playing styles. These abilities would have to be categorised also – One use, Unlimited use, Cost, No Cost, Tech levels and so on… And of course when these abilities after available. What is the most reasonable idea I’ve had so far is to have No cost abilities having to be activated by Points and cost abilities being available whenever.

These changes to the game relating to special abilities

-Some/All infantry squads are dropped by parachutes/drop pods. Somebody, I’m sure has mentioned this before. For God’s Sake this is the most futuristic game in the C&C universe is it not? So why do our damn drop ships have to land before ejecting their troops?!?!?

-Better effects for the explosion of the Tiberium vapour bomb and Catalyst missile.

Just a few ideas for the new special abilities

GDI
-Sonic Resonance Bomb (destroy your enemies’ Tiberium!)
-Overproduction(All war factories work 50% faster for a short period of time)

Nod
-Gap Generator (Create a small black area on the map – would work just like in RA would wear off after a time period)
-Rally (All Hands of Nod produce 4 militant squads each)
-Leaflet Drop(Think Generals)

Scrin
-Devastator Squadron (Spawns 3 devastators at selected location)
-Spike of Corruption (Spawns a spike that distributes Tiberium based slime around its location)
I think that, to some extent, this is a good idea but...
I know lots of people will disagree, but I really think it would be better if all the "generals powers" backup things were removed. It just seems like too much. Maybe one simple one for each team, like a small missile launch or bombing run, but when you don't even need to build troops, you can just wait for all the timers then bombard them and drop infantry pods in their base its just too much. You should have to survive on your wits and strategy, not on backup from base camp.
...this is a valid point, as well.

-Venoms fire one continuous laser with upgrade that literally slices infantry apart.
Why? Nod already has more anti-infantry units than any other faction in the game?

-Unarm the GDI APC and give it the ability to transport more units. As well as taking away the ability for units to fire from within it.

-Because of the above change the role of the APC will be replaced by a faster, futuristic hum-vee type vehicle that can only carry one squad.

In the original C&C, APCs has a machine gun. The reason that the APC is unarmed in Tiberian Sun is because it can run away over water or hitch a ride on a Carryall if it come under attack. The C&C 3 APC is not amphibious and its Call Transport ability is far too slow to serve as an effective escape mechanism, rendering an unarmed APC 100% helpless.

Perhaps two "new" APCs:
1)A lightly armored, unarmed, amphibious fast-attack APC that hold one squad and has gun ports (somewhat like Combat Cycles from ZH in function).
2)A heavily armored, machine gun equipped APC that holds multiple squads (old style APC)

-Add another walking unit to GDI’s arsenal. Something very titan in role and appearance would be the way to go. C&C3 seems to be lower tech in a lot of places than Tiberian Sun - the titan has been replaced by a conventional tank. The game story’s explanation for the phasing out of walking units was stupid IMHO.
Okay, here's a better explanation: walking units are top-heavy and prone to falling over. Also, money spent on leg joints could be put to better use buying thicker armor and a bigger engine.

-Reskin or replace the flame tank. It had been obsolete for a whole game and now its back?!? A solution would be giving a reskinned flametank the dozerblades upgrade instead of the scorpion getting it.
However, unlike all previous Flame Tank designs (including the Devil's Tongue), the C&C 3 Flame Tank has a turret. Also, Flamethrowers >> Dozer Blades

-Do something about the beam cannon. Its useless and looks stupid.
No. An individual Beam Cannon's is proportional to the number of Beam Cannon firepower firing at the same target. A group of six or seven Beam Cannon is absolutely brutal.

-Give GDI back some Hover vehicles – it seems that the Hover MLRS of TS has been given to Scrin in the form of the Seeker. That’s alright, but GDI needs some sort of vehicle that indicates they’ve actually progressed since the first Tib war.Pitbull ideas taken from here (http://www.ppmsite.com/forum/viewtopic.php?highlight=pitbull&t=14501) (hover upgrade) and here (http://www.ppmsite.com/forum/viewtopic.php?p=164797#164797) (starts with a machine gun and gets a Generals Humvee-style rocket upgrade)-Nod gets a hijackerShadow Team size is reduce to one "Shadow Operative" who is weaker than a normal shadow team in firepower but maintains the full strength of the demo charge ability and gains the ability to hijack vehicles. I also considered removing their cloaking ability while airborne or while moving on the ground (but not while stationary).
:rockbrow:

-Much more upgrades for all factions. It was sad to see that the upgrade system from generals was simplified for C&C3, where should have been extended.
C&C =/= Starcraft

That said, a carefully balanced and meaningful set of upgrades would be a welcome addition. +5% Armor = BAD. Unit gains new ability that adds a new layer of depth to the game = GOOD.

Squads: EA what were you thinking. Making a RTS squad based is the worst move possible. Squads are terrible. Single units only!
What's wrong with squads?

4.) The entire Scin race should be removed. I think they are great fun but they really don't fit into the story. I think they should remain a mystery; the conflict is between man and man, good vs evil, on a dying planet. Throwing aliens into the mix makes it too cliched, classic sci-fi.
That's great, but you're wasting a lot of material if you simply dump a whole side from the game.

As for cliche;
CABAL=HAL+Skynet+The Matrix+...
Titan=Gundam+Battlemech+Goliath(Starcraft)+...

-Zone troopers should be removed, they look stupid, as should the commando who is useless and is too generic. They should be replaced with the Ghost Stalker, who is a much better hero unit and has a rail gun. Making zone troopers have rail guns makes the rail gun too commonplace. If just the hero and the mammoth had it it would be special. Rail guns should also be removed off the predator tanks.
I see that you and 2ndLifeAmusement seem to think that a unit "looking stupid" is a good reason to get rid of it. As to the railgun, GDI has had the technology for twenty years.
Why is it that people complain that EA abandoned the "C&C feel" by phasing out mechs, which were in one game and are a strategically unsound design and which may well have been rendered obsolete by the invention of the tank, but are upset to see railguns, a powerful weapon that the military would certainly spend time developing, become more common?

-Possibly the addition of wolverines and/or titans. Pitbulls or Predators may have to be given up, but they're nothing special anyway.
The only difference between Pitbulls/Predators and Wolverines/Titans is that the Pitbulls and Predators are less likely to fall on their faces, let alone fall on their faces and get stuck.

-Some type of hover vehicle should be added, not necessarily an MLRS, maybe something original, but at least something that hovers.
Pitbull ideas taken from here (http://www.ppmsite.com/forum/viewtopic.php?highlight=pitbull&t=14501) (hover upgrade) and here (http://www.ppmsite.com/forum/viewtopic.php?p=164797#164797) (starts with a machine gun and gets a Generals Humvee-style rocket upgrade)
:rockbrow:

-jump jet infantry should be added, maybe to both GDI and NOD
Come on, ninjas? so so so out of place. and when they fly in circles in their little stupid hang gliders? give me a break.
Shadow Teams are Nod's answer to JJI; they are less useful in direct assault, but then again Nod is not an organization built around direct assault. Nod is built around stealth and subterfuge, which means that "ninjas," as you called them, are actually not out of place. On the contrary, they fit Nod's strategic paradigm quite nicely.

As for flying in circles, if they didn't, their gliders would loose lift and they'd fall to the ground and die.

-Cyborg commando should be the hero unit.
-Where are the cyborgs? they are such a classic NOD unit.
Great Idea:D! Bring back Cyborgs as an entirely new unit on the tech tree, not replacing anything. That is an idea I can get behind.

-the laser on the front of the helicopter should be replaced with a machine gun. Enough is enough with the lasers already. We get it, NOD loves lasers.
Actually, the laser on the Venom replaces a machine gun. It's an upgrade. Remember, Nod has had 20 years to go from laser turrets to laser tanks and laser choppers.

-make the scorpion tank deployable like the tick tank in Tib Sun
Would my idea satisfy you? Keep the Scorpion Tank as is, but...
Tick Tanks are similar to their Tiberian Sun counterparts, acting as a light Medium Tank. While mobile, weaker than a Predator, but while buried, about on par with a Predator, perhaps slightly better.

-Only allow for the building of one mammoth at a time, but amp up its power.
Mammoth Tanks are not prototypes. Perhaps GDI should have a prototype unit that has a build limit, but Mammoth Tanks are not that unit. (I am suspicious of any unit so powerful that it mandates a build limit. Heros are one of very few exceptions)

-That ridiculous avatar warmech absolutely has to be removed. Not only does it look more stupid and impractical than anything that ever hit the battlefield, its really not all that good. Its the **** can for the war mech.
But you want the Titan back?

Also, one problem that I have with the Avatar is that people seem to find it too useful and spam it.

I think having the nuke in the first place is out of place
Nod had nukes in C&C 1. Quite frankly, the Cluster Missile in Tiberian Sun was out of place because it represented a massive step backwards in technology for Nod.

Pathogen

06-06-2007, 02:32 PM

Some very good points, Quadhelix. Thanks for the response.

Allow me to clarify some of my ideas.

Firstly, why I dislike squads. Micromanaging is RTS's middle name. Micromanaging is what sets apart good players from great players. In Tiberium Wars it seems to be about who can mass the most diverse army fastest, not who has more skill in managing their troops in battle. Look at Tiberian Dawn, Sun, Generals and Zero Hour. All great games that I feel would have been brought down by squads. Look at any game Blizzard has ever made. Blizzard makes amazing strategy games. No one can argue that. None of their games have ever been squad based. Then look at Battle for Middle Earth. Don't get me wrong, I really liked the game but it was far more simplistic than other games mentioned above. The only games that I can think of that pull off squad based combat correctly are Dawn of War and Company of Heroes, and I still think those games would be better off if they didn't have squads.

I really like your idea about two kinds of APC.

On walking mechs: Here we go. This is probably the most discussed thing in this thread. First, your point makes sense for the Titan. That mech is unrealistic and would fall right on its face easily. The wolverine, however, is very low to the ground with legs that are thick and probably only about two feet long. It has no major protruding cannons (like the titan) to unbalance it. Also their legs have heavy armor plating. I think in the wolverines case it would have an advantage over the pitbull because its legs would be harder to destroy than the tires of the pitbull. Tires can be popped in real life, don't forget. As for tanks being more protective, tank treads are a huge weak spot. One small explosive in the tread mechanism could easily render the tank immobile, just as easily as the legs could be taken out of a walker. Another point, from a strictly sci-fi point of view (we all know this game doesn't try to be very realistic) it just seems more logical to have some walker mechs. Even if they are less practical in theory, they still seem more futuristic and in my mind should take a seat along side tanks, especially in this type of fantasy future game.
As for the Avatar Warmech, they say "nod found a way around the weakness of its legs" Well thats bull****. The avatar would be so much more vulnerable to leg damage and falling down because its so damn tall. It has big gangly legs. You say that looking stupid is not a good reason to remove a unit. A valid point, however many aesthetic shortcomings that also reflect physical inadequacies is enough for me. For example: The claw arm looks "stupid." By this I mean it looks far too flimsy to do any good whatsoever let alone rip a metal tank apart. The head (or lack thereof) also bothers me. With absolutely no head the line of sight would not only be blocked on the sides, but to look behind itself it would have to turn its whole body around, a major disadvantage. So while I only said that it looked "stupid" what I really meant was that it looked ineffective, which it most certainly does to me.

The Railgun. I know that its logical that more units would have them because of an increase in technology, but the point is that it takes away from the hero unit when he has a ****ty weapon. If only he had a rail gun he would be the man. But when every other guy has one he's not so good anymore. When he only has a machine gun, he really sucks. So how about a compromise? Zone troopers and tanks can still have a rail gun but the hero unit should have something even more advanced that only he has. Such as a disintegrator beam or something cool like that.

Shadow teams. My main problem with them is the gliders. It is simply not possible to maintain one altitude on a hang glider simply by spinning in circles. All they have to do is add tiny jets to the backpack portion of the glider and all problems would be solved. Then it would make sense.

As for the nuke, I was unaware that there was one in Dawn, so that voids my point. I do however still believe that its power should be turned down. It can really take out a base completely. No one likes to have their main headquarters with all their tech buildings taken out with one superweapon that is impossible to stop once launched.

Good point about not scrapping the Scrin. However if I were to make the mod I would probably not take them out but not mod them at all because I don't think it's worth the effort for something I don't want in there in the first place.

Zone troopers. Same as avatar warmech. I could deal with them in the game if they were just bulky infantry, but its the lack of a head that really bothers me. I already described why it's impractical and unsafe.

and finally, as for new units unbalancing the game, that can be easily worked out by adding a unit parallel on the opposing team(s).

2ndLifeAmusement

06-07-2007, 03:04 AM

Some good points Quadhelix.

That would enable/require a huge amount of micromanagement. Therefore, it would have to be done in such a way as to avoid forcing players to spend most of their time customizing individual units. Also, this idea runs the risk of promoting homogeneous armies, consisting mostly of a single type of unit; great care should be taken to make sure that each type of unit is just as important as every other type of unit.

I think you misunderstand. The customization would not be done in-game but your different "schemes" of customizations would selected pregame.

As for the confessor upgrade... The player customizing their squads would choose if they wanted a confessor to be leading their militants. I shouldn't have really said obsolete, it would just have to be changed in the way it works. ie. changing the types of grenades the confessor uses.

Regarding the venom laser:

Why? Nod already has more anti-infantry units than any other faction in the game?

The damage of the laser would not be upped, just a change in the look of it. Have the laser continuous but still inflict the same damage that is. A different infantry death animation for it would be good.

Perhaps two "new" APCs:
1)A lightly armored, unarmed, amphibious fast-attack APC that hold one squad and has gun ports (somewhat like Combat Cycles from ZH in function).
2)A heavily armored, machine gun equipped APC that holds multiple squads (old style APC)

Thats pretty much what i meant, just having the heavy APC unarmed. The normal GDI APC is just too slow. A faster infantry mover for GDI would expand the possibilities for more innovative tactics. Rather than: TECH UP TO MAMMIES AND KILL THOSE BASTARDS.

Okay, here's a better explanation: walking units are top-heavy and prone to falling over. Also, money spent on leg joints could be put to better use buying thicker armor and a bigger engine.

mmm, touche

However, for the sake of the game... Avatars are the most spindly, top heavy walker to date and thus very unrealistic. But honestly the avatar looks pretty damn good. I can see you point though... The game just needs more units.

However, unlike all previous Flame Tank designs (including the Devil's Tongue), the C&C 3 Flame Tank has a turret. Also, Flamethrowers >> Dozer Blades

True, However, adding the dozer blades upgrade to the Flame Tank would make the Scorp less anti-infantry and give the Flame Tank more effective a role. The units must have to be mixed up! It just makes the game so much more interesting.

No. An individual Beam Cannon's is proportional to the number of Beam Cannon firepower firing at the same target. A group of six or seven Beam Cannon is absolutely brutal.

I am yet to be attacked by six or seven Beam Cannons. I'll will try it.
You've gotta agree about the appearance of the Beam Cannon though, its really just not "Nod-looking". But then again... what is "Nod-looking?'

I stick to my original statement "Nod gets a hijacker". If you give this ability to a shadow it becomes OP and means you don't have to MIX UNITS.

Which is bad.

That said, a carefully balanced and meaningful set of upgrades would be a welcome addition. +5% Armor = BAD. Unit gains new ability that adds a new layer of depth to the game = GOOD.

Completely agree, We need more than four for each faction.

As for squads...
C&C3 ain't that different as RTSs go, but the squads set it apart from many other. Its a step in the right direction if you ask me.

As for the removal of scrin...
Yeah... it does make it stereotypical sci-fi, especially the fact that most of their art is inspired by insects. Scrin is a good, playable side it shouldn't be removed - it just is too much of the game. Anyway, they had to bring 'em in some time, its an inevitable part of the storyline.

I see that you and 2ndLifeAmusement seem to think that a unit "looking stupid" is a good reason to get rid of it. As to the railgun, GDI has had the technology for twenty years.
Why is it that people complain that EA abandoned the "C&C feel" by phasing out mechs, which were in one game and are a strategically unsound design and which may well have been rendered obsolete by the invention of the tank, but are upset to see railguns, a powerful weapon that the military would certainly spend time developing, become more common?

I never said anything about the increasingly common railgun. And as for thinking that stupid looks is a reason for getting rid of a unit... hell no! C&C3 lacks in the Unit quantity department already, we don't want units getting axed cause they look stupid. A reskinning is all i suggested.

Shadow Teams are Nod's answer to JJI; they are less useful in direct assault, but then again Nod is not an organization built around direct assault. Nod is built around stealth and subterfuge, which means that "ninjas," as you called them, are actually not out of place. On the contrary, they fit Nod's strategic paradigm quite nicely.

As for flying in circles, if they didn't, their gliders would loose lift and they'd fall to the ground and die.

I completely agree. Oh and Pathogen i would definitely reconsider criticizing any sort of Ninja. Otherwise someday you will be found lying dead in a park with a shuriken between your eyes.

Great Idea:D! Bring back Cyborgs as an entirely new unit on the tech tree, not replacing anything. That is an idea I can get behind.

Two reasons cyborgs are left out of C&C3

1. (The storyline reason) Nod would have been reluctant to start making more cyborgs after what happened with Cabal.
2. To make the game more accessible to the general public.

Well i think thats it.

New artillery unit for each side!
Nod - futuristic rocket buggy from ZH
GDI - A semi-artillery hovering missile platform
Scrin - Long range artillery piece with weak shot damage compensated by EMP effect

Quadhelix

06-07-2007, 12:19 PM

Firstly, why I dislike squads. Micromanaging is RTS's middle name. Micromanaging is what sets apart good players from great players. In Tiberium Wars it seems to be about who can mass the most diverse army fastest, not who has more skill in managing their troops in battle. Look at Tiberian Dawn, Sun, Generals and Zero Hour. All great games that I feel would have been brought down by squads. Look at any game Blizzard has ever made. Blizzard makes amazing strategy games. No one can argue that. None of their games have ever been squad based. Then look at Battle for Middle Earth. Don't get me wrong, I really liked the game but it was far more simplistic than other games mentioned above. The only games that I can think of that pull off squad based combat correctly are Dawn of War and Company of Heroes, and I still think those games would be better off if they didn't have squads. In my view, squads are just like single infantry units, except that they loose firepower as they take damage (there are some other, minor differences, but that's basically it).

I really like your idea about two kinds of APC. Thanks.

The wolverine, however, is very low to the ground with legs that are thick and probably only about two feet long. It has no major protruding cannons (like the titan) to unbalance it. Also their legs have heavy armor plating. I think in the wolverines case it would have an advantage over the pitbull because its legs would be harder to destroy than the tires of the pitbull. True, but the two should exist together because the Pitbull would be faster.

Tires can be popped in real life, don't forget. As for tanks being more protective, tank treads are a huge weak spot. One small explosive in the tread mechanism could easily render the tank immobile, just as easily as the legs could be taken out of a walker. Of course, a loosing a tread or a leg will not cause the vehicle to fall over, unlike the loss of a leg on a mech.

The claw arm looks "stupid." By this I mean it looks far too flimsy to do any good whatsoever let alone rip a metal tank apart. Good point.

The head (or lack thereof) also bothers me. With absolutely no head the line of sight would not only be blocked on the sides, but to look behind itself it would have to turn its whole body around, a major disadvantage. Zone troopers. Same as avatar warmech. I could deal with them in the game if they were just bulky infantry, but its the lack of a head that really bothers me. I already described why it's impractical and unsafe. Of course, given that the mech probably has cameras and other sensors mounted on the sides and back, a head becomes just another vulnerable critical area. Somewhat the same for the troopers. Why put vulnerable glass as the only protection for the soldier's head when you can put real armor and use a camera instead?

The Railgun. I know that its logical that more units would have them because of an increase in technology, but the point is that it takes away from the hero unit when he has a ****ty weapon. If only he had a rail gun he would be the man. But when every other guy has one he's not so good anymore. When he only has a machine gun, he really sucks. So how about a compromise? Zone troopers and tanks can still have a rail gun but the hero unit should have something even more advanced that only he has. Such as a disintegrator beam or something cool like that. In the original C&C, the Commando had a Sniper Rifle, which slaughtered infantry but was useless against tanks, and C4, which could not be used against tanks.

The new (modded) GDI Commando might be somewhat like Col. Burton from Generals, i.e., a gun useful against all targets. Perhaps a burst Sniper Rifle with an anti-tank grenade launcher. The Nod Cyborg Commando could have a Plasma Cannon that is deadly against vehicles and aircraft but very weak against infantry (still kills infantrymen in one shot, but because infantry are in squads and are so cheap, the Cyborg Commando can't keep up).

Remember, even hero units should have a counter.

Shadow teams. My main problem with them is the gliders. It is simply not possible to maintain one altitude on a hang glider simply by spinning in circles. All they have to do is add tiny jets to the backpack portion of the glider and all problems would be solved. Then it would make sense. Good point, but I doubt that most modders are going to want to add such a trivial detail (but it would be great if they did add it)

I do however still believe that its power should be turned down. It can really take out a base completely. No one likes to have their main headquarters with all their tech buildings taken out with one superweapon that is impossible to stop once launched. I agree. One way to fix is to use something similar to the GLA Holes from Generals, which are fragile but rebuild destroyed GLA structures (and are really annoying when using a nuke against the GLA because the structures are destroyed but leave behind their holes, which then rebuild the structures). Another possibility is to extent "mech husk" logic to buildings.

The damage of the laser would not be upped, just a change in the look of it. Have the laser continuous but still inflict the same damage that is. A different infantry death animation for it would be good. The problem is that a continuous laser would work completely differently from the current laser system. It would not just be a graphic change.

I stick to my original statement "Nod gets a hijacker". If you give this ability to a shadow it becomes OP and means you don't have to MIX UNITS. If you're using Shadow Teams, your force is already rather diverse, unless you're rushing, in which case you're not going to waste Shadow's hijacking vehicles. Actually, you gave me something of an idea.

The way that Overlords were "component tanks," Shadow Operatives could become "component infantry." The basic Shadow Operative costs $800 and is basically unchanged, but slightly stronger to make up for the absence of his three buddies (but not much stronger). He cloaks, hang glides, and has dual machine pistols that he decloaks to fire. However, he has several, mutually exclusive upgrades that give him new abilities:Sniper Training ($700): This Shadow Operative's machine pistols have been replaced with a Sniper Rifle that allows him to attack enemy infantry from long range without decloaking.

Demolition Charges ($500): This Shadow Operative has been equipped with the old Shadow Teams demolition charges.

Sabotage Equipment ($500): This Shadow Operative can act as a ZH Saboteur, disabling the structure that he enters (one use)

Hijacking ($300): This Shadow Operative can steal enemy vehicles
I never said anything about the increasingly common railgun. And as for thinking that stupid looks is a reason for getting rid of a unit... hell no! C&C3 lacks in the Unit quantity department already, we don't want units getting axed cause they look stupid. A reskinning is all i suggested. I talking to Pathogen about the railgun and you did say "reskin or replace".

1. (The storyline reason) Nod would have been reluctant to start making more cyborgs after what happened with Cabal. Except that no repeat should be possible. Cyborgs can be made that a computer would be unable to control, as Cyborgs are human beings with robotic parts, not robots with human parts.

*********************************************************

In other ideas, I have finally found a way to make the Mammoth Tank less effective as a solitary unit. First, I would change the cost so that Predators cost $900 each and Mammoths cost $3000 each.

Then, I would make sure that Mammoths had twice the firepower and twice the health of the Predators (so 1 Mammoth vs. 3 Predators = tied battle). Then, I would add a 75mm Cannon to the Predator so that its firepower is greater than half of the Mammoth's(this is going somewhere, I promise).

Thus, the Predators are moderatly more cost effective than Mammoths. However, the Mammoths have a new ability that makes up for their extra cost; unlike the ECM Tank from ZH, which would scramble enemy missiles away from itself and nearby units, the new Mammoth Tank draws enemy missiles toward itself and away from nearby friendlies, allowing it to put its superior health to good use. About half of the missiles that a Mammoth Tank scrambles will miss and the other half will hit the Mammoth Tank. Unfortunately, missiles aimed at Mammoth Tanks will not be scrambled, even by other Mammoths.

Pathogen

06-09-2007, 02:16 PM

But if they were able to produce missile scrambling technology, why not just scramble them right into the ground in front of the tank instead of purposely absorbing all the missiles?

Quadhelix

06-09-2007, 03:19 PM

Predator Tanks will also benefit from the Pitbull's rocket upgrade, gaining AA rockets
I would just like to say that I now realize that I most likely got this idea from here (http://www.ppmsite.com/forum/viewtopic.php?p=164797#164797). Sorry.

But if they were able to produce missile scrambling technology, why not just scramble them right into the ground in front of the tank instead of purposely absorbing all the missiles? Because the entire purpose of the missile scrambler ability is to keep players from building Mammoth Tanks only. This idea gives them a similar role to the Arbiters in Starcraft, which cloak nearby units but not other Arbiters.

Speaking of units that cloak other units, perhaps the Mobile Stealth Generator should make a return.

As for Nod's Subterranean units, I had an idea for Subterranean Missile Artillery (like a Missile Sub, on the premise that subterranean warfare = submarine warfare, at least on some level). Its missiles are easily shot down by AA defenses, but it can sneak to firing positions that aren't covered by AA. That, along with the Subterranean APC, should be a good start for Nod's Subterranean forces.

2ndLifeAmusement

06-11-2007, 04:21 AM

As for Nod's Subterranean units, I had an idea for Subterranean Missile Artillery (like a Missile Sub, on the premise that subterranean warfare = submarine warfare, at least on some level). Its missiles are easily shot down by AA defenses, but it can sneak to firing positions that aren't covered by AA. That, along with the Subterranean APC, should be a good start for Nod's Subterranean forces.

Or just subterranean missiles themselves. A support power perhaps?

I'm all in favour of bringing back sub units. Adds a new dimension to the gameplay.

Quadhelix

06-11-2007, 03:02 PM

Or just subterranean missiles themselves. A support power perhaps? Oops. I think that I might have miscommunicated or I am misunderstanding what you are saying. I meant unit that acted like a RA2 V3 or a Generals Scud Launcher and traveled underground, not a unit that fired missiles that traveled underground (although that is an interesting idea).

What was quite disappointing about C&C3 is that the special ability system present from Generals had been simplified instead of extended. What would be really good changing this special weapon system to be more of a cross between the Generals Powers in Generals and the Card System in AOEIII.

Players would be able to make schemes of abilities from a huge list to be present in the game. For example say you had a limit of 15 abilities, and there was more than 200 to pick from your faction, you would select abilities that catered to your strategies and playing styles. These abilities would have to be categorised also – One use, Unlimited use, Cost, No Cost, Tech levels and so on… And of course when these abilities after available. What is the most reasonable idea I’ve had so far is to have No cost abilities having to be activated by Points and cost abilities being available whenever. In addition to a limit on the number of Command Powers that a player can use, how about a system of mutually exclusive upgrades that effect how the game is played.

EX.: Pitbulls come equipped with a machine gun (possibly still AA, but not as strong as missiles) but no missiles, and Mammoth Tanks retain their dual 150mm cannon but do not have missiles. There are several related upgrades:Pitbull Missiles ($1000): Allows individual Pitbulls to purchase a $50 upgrade replacing their machine gun with missile launchers.

Tank Missiles ($3000): Predator Tanks and Mammoth Tanks gain AA missile launchers (one on Predators, two on Mammoths). Requires that Pitbull Missiles have been researched and that Railguns remain unresearched.

Railguns ($5000): No real change except that Railguns cannot be researched once Tank Missiles have been researched.
[Edit: 6/12/2007]

Also, when Scrin and Humans capture each others unit producers, Humans should not be able to produce Scrin units and the Scrin should not be able to produce human infantry. (Or is this already the case?)

[Edit: 6/19/2007]

Another few ideas, since it has been "ages" since anyone posted here.

1. Give GDI Engineers an EMP Ability.

2. Give Nod Militants a "Dig-in" ability to produce "Camouflage Tents," similar Generals Stinger Sites with Zero Hour Camo Netting. In other words, attacking the Camouflage Tent damages the infantry inside more than it damages the tent, but the tent is invisible when the units inside are not attacking.

3. New Unit: Nod Cyber Ninja (name shamelessly stolen from Civilization: Call to Power). Cyber Ninja (plural) can hack enemy buildings, acting somewhat like a long-range, reusable version of RA1's Spy (i.e., hacking a Barracks shows what type of infantry is being trained, etc.). Cyber Ninja can also infect enemy vehicles with a computer virus that act somewhat like Yuri's Revenge's chaos gas, but also causes the vehicle to randomly shut down. The virus lasts for about 20 seconds and has a small chance of spreading to other vehicles.

bones2k

06-20-2007, 03:19 AM

i would put a choose if you want super weopns on or off

but donno how to do it :cry:

iwdu15

06-20-2007, 01:11 PM

im thinking of modding it to add all Red Alert and Generals factions.....any interest?

bones2k

06-21-2007, 02:57 AM

im thinking of modding it to add all Red Alert and Generals factions.....any interest?
donno what to make of it but it sounds good

Hayden-G

06-21-2007, 09:20 AM

bones2k

06-21-2007, 11:29 AM

i would put a choose if you want super weopns on or off

but donno how to do it :cry:
can someone plz do that
i would do it but i donno how

Quadhelix

06-21-2007, 12:06 PM

I want to make annihilator tripods less powerful, or less defense, or more expensive. They're a little overpowered imo. It's great when you have them, but when a swarm of them comes at you its kinda hard to stop. Maybe I just don't have a correct strategy. I know that this thread has gotten rather long, but...

Annihilator Tripods' guns are replaced with weapons similar to the ECM Tank's beam from Zero Hour.
...I already said something rather similar 2 pages ago.

im thinking of modding it to add all Red Alert and Generals factions.....any interest? That was discussed on the first (http://forums.cncden.com/showthread.php?t=19258) and second page (http://forums.cncden.com/showthread.php?t=19258&page=2) of this thread, to some extent (more Generals than Red Alert), so there is definitely some interest. However...

GLA wouldn't fit in, period, due to the extreme amount of differences between them and all of the other races, with the biggest being the power demand that they lack, and the foot workers being rediculously vunerable to tiberium.:gnarly: ...the GLA would be rather difficult to include.

On a side note, nobody made any comment about the ideas I included in my last post...

I'M NOT LOVED! :cry:
(Just kidding. Seriously.)

bones2k

06-22-2007, 03:08 PM

how can i make it so you can choose if u want super weapons on or off

Quadhelix

06-22-2007, 05:09 PM

i would put a choose if you want super weopns on or off

but donno how to do it :cry: can someone plz do that
i would do it but i donno how how can i make it so you can choose if u want super weapons on or off Okay. For simple mods, such as (I'm going out on a limb, here) editing unit health or weapon damage, for now the only way to mod is to directly edit the game's INI files.

Unfortunately, what you want is slightly more complex, so you're probably stuck waiting for the SDK (Software Development Kit). EA has said that they are planning on releasing the SDK at some point in the near future, so you better make sure that your great, great grandchildren really, really want to mod C&C3 so that their children will be ready when the SDK comes out.

bones2k

06-24-2007, 10:44 AM

guess i will have to wait for it

then i am going to give it a go

Quadhelix

06-29-2007, 06:23 PM

"The Thread is going into fibrillation. Charge the defibrillator to 1000 Volts!"
________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________

Since nobody has posted here in several days, I might as well continue making suggestions:

1) A return of the "Generals Promotion" concept, although implemented in the "Contra" method, with advanced units requiring only that the player achieve a certain rank rather than costing "Generals Points," which should be reserved for Command Abilities.

2) As 2ndLifeAmusement suggested in this post (http://forums.cncden.com/showpost.php?p=344824&postcount=69), diversify the Command Abilities, but make limit the number of "Generals Points." Expanding on that idea, some Command Abilities could be mutually exclusive, and some command abilities could require other command abilities. Also, "Generals Points" could be purchased monetarily instead of via promotion, which would offer the player an interesting choice: save up "Generals Points" for the more advanced abilities at higher ranks or "tech up" as quickly as possible in hope of a quick win.

3) Modify building capture to work on the "Mech husk" system as well as (or perhaps instead of) the old C&C method. This has the added benefit of allowing you to "capture" your old buildings after a superweapon strike. If base defenses can be captured at all, they can be captured only through the "husk" system.

Hopefully, at least one of these ideas will help.
________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________

"CLEAR!"

bones2k

07-03-2007, 03:26 PM

then the kit comes out i am going to give a try on maken super weapons a chose on or off

but i will need a hand if anyone will help me step by step

Avapodnaught

07-03-2007, 09:13 PM

Contra? Man, that was a good mod for superunits... if u last long enough to build them, made the laser generals laser weapons suck... But the Particle tank weapon was awesome...

Quadhelix

07-14-2007, 01:25 PM

Arazoid

07-14-2007, 07:52 PM

Ex-westwoodian Adam Isgreen answered a question regarding what they had planned to do with mechs in the Westwoods build of C&C3:

"GDI was going away from mechs, yes. There were still a few, but Nod had gotten so good at taking out the leg joints on them with infantry that the repair and construction costs became prohibitive and the design was ruled "impractical"."

Source: http://www.petroglyphgames.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=3074

Daishi

07-14-2007, 10:25 PM

I have heard some complaints about the "uselessness of infantry (http://forums.cncden.com/showthread.php?t=19595)" in Tiberium Wars. While Patch 1.05 has made improvements, here are some other possible ideas:

1. Certain infantrymen, such as rocket squads, explode when run over.

Grenadiers should definitely explode a little, though not as severely as disintegrators or fanatics.

2. Infantrymen act as short range detectors, able to locate vehicles under the effect of the Nod Cloaking Field power. Stealth Tanks and "cloaked" infantry, such as Shadow Teams, are immune to infantry-based "semi-detection" (they are not, however, immune to infantrymen that are "full detectors").This would be unnecessary in all regards, and perhaps just complicating. All Nod cloaking should be treated the same.

3. Infantry are "camouflaged" and, while detectable, must be "twice as close" in order to be seen (i.e., if a unit has a vision range of 12 units, it can see only those infantrymen that are within 6 units). This ability does not apply to garrisonsDetect range is A-OK for all units as of now, except perhaps the PAC. It would be realistic and therefore appreciated if this change was implemented, though.

4. Infantrymen have the ability to scale cliffs, as Colonel Burton dd in Generals and Zero Hour or Saboteurs did in ZH.Jumpjets on ZTs and GDI commando and Ox/Carryall are sufficient IMO.

Ex-westwoodian Adam Isgreen answered a question regarding what they had planned to do with mechs in the Westwoods build of C&C3:

"GDI was going away from mechs, yes. There were still a few, but Nod had gotten so good at taking out the leg joints on them with infantry that the repair and construction costs became prohibitive and the design was ruled "impractical"."

Source: http://www.petroglyphgames.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=3074

It's why there's nothing in our military like that. Mechs are friggin cool, but legs will always be impractical for any sort of colossal war machine

Quadhelix

07-15-2007, 10:55 AM

3. Infantry are "camouflaged" and, while detectable, must be "twice as close" in order to be seen (i.e., if a unit has a vision range of 12 units, it can see only those infantrymen that are within 6 units). This ability does not apply to garrisons I think that I might have been unclear with this: in this one instance, by "detectable," I mean "visible to any unit, Detector or otherwise." I make this distinction because usually I use "detectable" to mean "visible to Detector units."

One thing that bugs me about Generals and Zero Hour is that, somehow, units that are "camouflaged" are so well hidden that a soldier can walk up to a camouflaged Command Center, one of the largest objects in the game and certainly a hundred or more times the soldier's size, and despite being so close that he could kick the Command Center, all he sees is level ground! Not even a mound of "dirt" or some foliage, but the building is 100% invisible! Also, how does messing up someone GPS make you troops completely invisible? I though that Generals was supposed to be realistic!

Therefore, this idea of mine:
2. Give Nod Militants a "Dig-in" ability to produce "Camouflage Tents," similar Generals Stinger Sites with Zero Hour Camo Netting. In other words, attacking the Camouflage Tent damages the infantry inside more than it damages the tent, but the tent is invisible when the units inside are not attacking. ...needs to be altered or abandoned.

________________________________________________________________________________

This would be unnecessary in all regards, and perhaps just complicating. All Nod cloaking should be treated the same. Maybe. On the other hand, it would provide incentive to build Stealth Tanks instead of building Attack Bikes and then cloaking them.

Grenadiers should definitely explode a little, though not as severely as disintegrators or fanatics. What about Rocketmen? They are, after all, the main anti-tank infantry.

Jumpjets on ZTs and GDI commando and Ox/Carryall are sufficient IMO. True, but jumpjets have to recharge, Oxes and Carryalls can be shot down, and I seriously doubt that anyone wants to spend $500 to ferry a $300 Rifleman Squad (or worse, a $200 Militant Squad) anywhere.

Edit 1 (7/20/2007 1:44 PM):
New Command Power Idea: (Nod) Expand-Creates an Outpost at the targeted location.

New Unit: Banshee Interceptor-Armed with an Anti-Air only Stormrider cannon with only about 1/3-1/2 rate of fire. Can fire a beacon at a target that increases its rate of fire against that target, but it must rearm the beacon its rearm site.

Edit 2 (7/23/2007 9:40 PM):
Here is an idea that completely changes the game: structures must be manned (garrisoned) by Engineers in order to function (although Engineers will now be in squads of 5-6). If the Engineering Team abandons a structure, it falls to neutral control and can be captured by enemy Engineering Teams.

Grenadiers/Black Hand/Flame Tanks/Corrupters are unable to clear enemy Engineering Teams from the structures that they operate. That role falls to Riflemen/Militants/Buzzers (basically, the infantrymen have to enter the building and do a sweep too clear out the enemy Engineers [re: Chinook+Ranger Combat Drop, Generals]).

Note that you can put Rifleman/Militant Squads in a building instead of an Engineering Team (to act as security), but doing so keeps the building from operating at 100%. Every structure built comes with its maximum number of Engineering Teams (much as Troop Crawlers in Generals came with Red Guardsmen).

Con. Yard: 4 team max.
Power Plant: 1 team max.
Barracks/Hand of Nod: 1 team max.
Radar: 2 team max.
War Factory: 3 team max.
Tech Center: 5 team max.

Therefore, a War Factory manned by 2 Engineering Teams would operate at 67% efficiency, taking half-and-again as long to produce the same units.

Edit 3:
-Engineering Teams would need to have "Ammo" limiting their ability to repair structures. Engineering Teams trained at the Barracks have one "repair kit," which allows them to repair structures like an old fashion Engineer. Engineering Teams that come with structures have no repair kit.

-Infantry damage types vs. vehicle damage types: Missile Squad rockets would do more damage to Scorpion Tanks than Pitbull rockets, however, Pitbull rockets would do more damage to Flame Tanks than Missile Squad rockets.

AugustSonereal

08-15-2007, 01:07 PM

How about making Tiberuim alot more destructive?

1. Triple Tiberuim Growth Rate
2. Make it so that Tiberuim from destroyed Tiberuim Spikes and Silos (and Harversters and whatnot), can spread too.
3. Make it so that tiberuim isn't limited to that small area around the center.
4. Units that die in the tiberuim becomes a marauder or something, and attacks any units close by.
5. Buildings can be destroyed if their in the way of a tiberuim field.
6. NOD's Catalyst Missle spreads though the whole tiberuim field. Any tiberuim related buildings around the field blow up and release more tiberuim.
7. The Liquid Tiberuim Bomb in skirmish.
8. Buildings are destroyed like walkers, they leave behind a husk and Engineers can repair it and gain control over it.
9. When player a game with 3 or more players, and 1 loses, their remaining units become violent and attack nearby player bases.
10. All Vehicles also leave behind husks.
11. When a Black Hand or Flame Tank burns down a building, the husk remains on fire. *comsmetic really*.

A lot of other stuff too. Like Superweapons *I like superweapons*

Quadhelix

08-15-2007, 03:39 PM

1. Triple Tiberuim Growth Rate I'm slightly skeptical of this one, partially because I maintain that Tiberium is far more valuable than it should be.

2. Make it so that Tiberuim from destroyed Tiberuim Spikes and Silos (and Harversters and whatnot), can spread too.
3. Make it so that tiberuim isn't limited to that small area around the center. With both of these, on the other hand, I agree almost completely.

4. Units that die in the tiberuim becomes a marauder or something, and attacks any units close by. Visceroids, would be more faithful to...just about every other Command&Conquer game. Actually, the Nod campaign in Tiberian Sun gives the impression that the Forgotten (i.e., Tiberium Mutants) were created by Nod experiments into "Divination."

5. Buildings can be destroyed if their in the way of a tiberuim field. Maybe, although it is a trait absent from Tiberium in the First and Second Tiberium Wars. Now Tiberium Veins, on the other hand...

6. NOD's Catalyst Missle spreads though the whole tiberuim field. Any tiberuim related buildings around the field blow up and release more tiberuim. This could spell disaster on a Red Zone map:evil:. ("Well, I'll just blow up the enemy's Harvesters with my Catalyst Missile." BOOM! BOOM! BOOM! BOOM! BOOM! BOOM! BOOM! BOOM! BOOM! BOOM! BOOM! BOOM! BOOM! BOOM! BOOM! BOOM! BOOM! BOOM! BOOM! BOOM! BOOM! BOOM! BOOM! BOOM! BOOM! BOOM! BOOM! BOOM! BOOM! BOOM! BOOM! BOOM! BOOM! BOOM! BOOM! "WHAT HAPPENED TO MY BASE?")

7. The Liquid Tiberuim Bomb in skirmish. A use for the aforementioned Tiberium Veins!

8. Buildings are destroyed like walkers, they leave behind a husk and Engineers can repair it and gain control over it. 3) Modify building capture to work on the "Mech husk" system as well as (or perhaps instead of) the old C&C method. This has the added benefit of allowing you to "capture" your old buildings after a superweapon strike. If base defenses can be captured at all, they can be captured only through the "husk" system. :rockbrow: I agree.

9. When player a game with 3 or more players, and 1 loses, their remaining units become violent and attack nearby player bases. Or, set the victory conditions so that the player does not loose until every last one of his/her units and structures are taking dirt naps.

10. All Vehicles also leave behind husks. Sounds like an interesting idea, although it might not be worth it for cheaper vehicles (the Nod Raider Buggy costs less than the Engineer you would use to capture it). Also, if regular vehicles do leave husks, Mech husks should be "special" somehow, perhaps returning to full health after capture.

11. When a Black Hand or Flame Tank burns down a building, the husk remains on fire. *comsmetic really*.Or it could work like a burning building in Starcraft or (from what I've heard) Tiberian Dawn: a burning building (or husk) will slowly loose health until the building and its husk are destroyed or the fire goes out.

A lot of other stuff too. Like Superweapons *I like superweapons* I'm more of the school of thought that, while one "Superweapon" per side is okay, it should not be game ending and the majority of the rest of the Command Powers should do little to no damage to keep players from turtling in their base and sniping with Nuclear Silos.

The recent Starcraft 2 campaign preview gave me a campaign economy idea, based mostly on Mech Commander. The idea, boiled down to its essence, is that some of the Player's funds and units carry over from mission to mission.

Mission Funds vs. Campaign Funds
Your Mission Funds are the money that you have available during a mission to build structures and defenses, train troops, and build vehicles. Your mission funds are, as always, equal to your starting funds plus any money made through harvesting, Tech Structures, etc. minus any expenses.

Your Campaign Funds are the money carried over from mission to mission and can be used to purchase new unit types and Command Abilities (think Generals Points), transport units from mission to mission, and are added to the Player's starting funds at the beginning of each mission. The Players campaign funds are equal to the player's Mission Funds at the end of the previous mission, but never exceed the the Campaign Funds from before the start of that mission plus half of all funds harvested during that mission (any excess is lost).

Unit Carryover
Players can use their Campaign Funds at the end of a mission to transport units from that mission to the next. Infantry Squads cost $100, light vehicles cost $250, and heavy vehicles cost $1,000. Players must build a side specific Reinforcement Structure (GDI: Dropship Pad; Nod: Tunnel Exit; Scrin: ??? [Stargate???]) or capture a specific Tech Structure (Reinforcement Bay retool?) in order to gain access to the units from the previous missions.

Technology Bunkers
Throughout the course of the campaign, the player can gain access to new units, command abilities, and upgrades by means of Tech Structures known as "Technology Bunkers." Although capture of a Technology Bunker has no immediate effect, it does give the Player access for new technologies for use in future missions

AugustSonereal

08-18-2007, 05:31 PM

I'm slightly skeptical of this one, partially because I maintain that Tiberium is far more valuable than it should be.

With both of these, on the other hand, I agree almost completely.

Visceroids, would be more faithful to...just about every other Command&Conquer game. Actually, the Nod campaign in Tiberian Sun gives the impression that the Forgotten (i.e., Tiberium Mutants) were created by Nod experiments into "Divination."

Maybe, although it is a trait absent from Tiberium in the First and Second Tiberium Wars. Now Tiberium Veins, on the other hand...

This could spell disaster on a Red Zone map:evil:. ("Well, I'll just blow up the enemy's Harvesters with my Catalyst Missile." BOOM! BOOM! BOOM! BOOM! BOOM! BOOM! BOOM! BOOM! BOOM! BOOM! BOOM! BOOM! BOOM! BOOM! BOOM! BOOM! BOOM! BOOM! BOOM! BOOM! BOOM! BOOM! BOOM! BOOM! BOOM! BOOM! BOOM! BOOM! BOOM! BOOM! BOOM! BOOM! BOOM! BOOM! BOOM! "WHAT HAPPENED TO MY BASE?")

A use for the aforementioned Tiberium Veins!

:rockbrow: I agree.

Or, set the victory conditions so that the player does not loose until every last one of his/her units and structures are taking dirt naps.

Sounds like an interesting idea, although it might not be worth it for cheaper vehicles (the Nod Raider Buggy costs less than the Engineer you would use to capture it). Also, if regular vehicles do leave husks, Mech husks should be "special" somehow, perhaps returning to full health after capture.

Or it could work like a burning building in Starcraft or (from what I've heard) Tiberian Dawn: a burning building (or husk) will slowly loose health until the building and its husk are destroyed or the fire goes out.

I'm more of the school of thought that, while one "Superweapon" per side is okay, it should not be game ending and the majority of the rest of the Command Powers should do little to no damage to keep players from turtling in their base and sniping with Nuclear Silos.

The recent Starcraft 2 campaign preview gave me a campaign economy idea, based mostly on Mech Commander. The idea, boiled down to its essence, is that some of the Player's funds and units carry over from mission to mission.

Mission Funds vs. Campaign Funds
Your Mission Funds are the money that you have available during a mission to build structures and defenses, train troops, and build vehicles. Your mission funds are, as always, equal to your starting funds plus any money made through harvesting, Tech Structures, etc. minus any expenses.

Your Campaign Funds are the money carried over from mission to mission and can be used to purchase new unit types and Command Abilities (think Generals Points), transport units from mission to mission, and are added to the Player's starting funds at the beginning of each mission. The Players campaign funds are equal to the player's Mission Funds at the end of the previous mission, but never exceed the the Campaign Funds from before the start of that mission plus half of all funds harvested during that mission (any excess is lost).

Unit Carryover
Players can use their Campaign Funds at the end of a mission to transport units from that mission to the next. Infantry Squads cost $100, light vehicles cost $250, and heavy vehicles cost $1,000. Players must build a side specific Reinforcement Structure (GDI: Dropship Pad; Nod: Tunnel Exit; Scrin: ??? [Stargate???]) or capture a specific Tech Structure (Reinforcement Bay retool?) in order to gain access to the units from the previous missions.

Technology Bunkers
Throughout the course of the campaign, the player can gain access to new units, command abilities, and upgrades by means of Tech Structures known as "Technology Bunkers." Although capture of a Technology Bunker has no immediate effect, it does give the Player access for new technologies for use in future missions

Your idea would fit in well with the expansion I heard so much about. I know what you mean about the growth and how tiberuim is worth too much. So reducing the price of tiberuim in proportion with the increase in growth. *4 times the growth with 600 per load*. Plus, I want the tiberuim to be so deadly and destructive, that when the superweapon charges players ask themselves if they should try to take out the enemy quickly with the weapon, or buy some time buy destroying the very close tiberuim.

Plus, too many people are building 2 refineries next to a field and that's enough to substain the war-effort.

About superweapons, how about adding a lot for each side, each with it a different charge time to power. But you can only have 1. Plus, super strong superweapons take longer to build and takes a lot more power and costs a helluva lot more.

Reduce the engineer cost a bit? Also, EVERY unit and building? I played a game on a huge 8 player map, and it was a longer than it should be because the enemy had a single building out. How about the player needs to kill all units and buildings with ground control. Who cares if the power plant is still up, ha.

The tiberuim>building trait is missing from previous TWs. But this isn't the same tiberuim. So, how about making it so buildings aren't destroyed per-se, but not usuable. Some buildings in game seem to have tiberuim growing in them. So, if your barracks is in the way, instead of it being destroyed, it's just "infected' (for lack of better word). And for kicks, how about that building being able to produce it's units in half the time and no costs, in exchange that you can't control it (if the enemy is at your door and annoy the hell at of you, this would be a great going away present).

Besides, this game needs more tiberuim creatures, there is none really (or 2, but I didn't think that corrupter was spitting tiberuim, or that the hovel was creating tiberuim units)

Also, I'm thinking of getting rid of the confessor upgrade and making it it's own unit. That throws those grenade things (they do work, I've seen how cool they are, after a grenadier squad kill the confessor and his henchmen, they preceeded to throw grenades at each other til' one was left standing)

Quadhelix

08-19-2007, 11:00 AM

Your idea would fit in well with the expansion I heard so much about. Which idea?

I know what you mean about the growth and how tiberuim is worth too much. So reducing the price of tiberuim in proportion with the increase in growth. *4 times the growth with 600 per load*. Plus, I want the tiberuim to be so deadly and destructive, that when the superweapon charges players ask themselves if they should try to take out the enemy quickly with the weapon, or buy some time buy destroying the very close tiberuim. The tiberuim>building trait is missing from previous TWs. But this isn't the same tiberuim. So, how about making it so buildings aren't destroyed per-se, but not usuable. Some buildings in game seem to have tiberuim growing in them. So, if your barracks is in the way, instead of it being destroyed, it's just "infected' (for lack of better word). And for kicks, how about that building being able to produce it's units in half the time and no costs, in exchange that you can't control it (if the enemy is at your door and annoy the hell at of you, this would be a great going away present). Or, we could just re-add Tiberium Veins. Also, making Tiberium destructive would discourage expansion, it would be disadvantageous to send your Harvesters, which are your only defense against the growing plague, off to harvest another field.

Plus, too many people are building 2 refineries next to a field and that's enough to substain the war-effort. If Tiberium grows more rapidly, it will make expansion less important. Perhaps instead of cutting Tiberium's value to 1/3, it could be cut to 1/6 but the Harvester's load size is doubled (so each Harvester takes in only 1/3 the original load value but has to harvest twice as many crystals to do so). This would cause the player to "deplete" Tiberium fields more rapidly and thus require greater expansion efforts.

About superweapons, how about adding a lot for each side, each with it a different charge time to power. But you can only have 1. Plus, super strong superweapons take longer to build and takes a lot more power and costs a helluva lot more. One Superweapon, total, out of all the options, or one of each? One total seems like a good idea and would force the Player to make some interesting choices.

Reduce the engineer cost a bit?Maybe. On the other hand, a light vehicle like a Pitbull or Raider Buggy would probably be too badly damaged to be field-salvaged anyway.

Also, EVERY unit and building? I played a game on a huge 8 player map, and it was a longer than it should be because the enemy had a single building out. How about the player needs to kill all units and buildings with ground control. Who cares if the power plant is still up, ha. That might be a good idea. Then again, power plants can be sold to acquire infantry, so that doesn't work 100%.

Besides, this game needs more tiberuim creatures, there is none really (or 2, but I didn't think that corrupter was spitting tiberuim, or that the hovel was creating tiberuim units) Needs ASAP: New Visceroid (the blob, the blob I tell you!), Tiberium Fiends, Tiberium Floaters, and more variety in the Tiberium Mutants. Other Tiberium Lifeforms would also be a treat.

Also, I'm thinking of getting rid of the confessor upgrade and making it it's own unit. That throws those grenade things (they do work, I've seen how cool they are, after a grenadier squad kill the confessor and his henchmen, they preceeded to throw grenades at each other til' one was left standing) Interesting idea. The current setup might make Nod's basic infantry overpowered (a $200 squad able to cause a large group of enemies to slaughter one another).

Here is an idea that completely changes the game: structures must be manned (garrisoned) by Engineers in order to function (although Engineers will now be in squads of 5-6). If the Engineering Team abandons a structure, it falls to neutral control and can be captured by enemy Engineering Teams.

Grenadiers/Black Hand/Flame Tanks/Corrupters are unable to clear enemy Engineering Teams from the structures that they operate. That role falls to Riflemen/Militants/Buzzers (basically, the infantrymen have to enter the building and do a sweep too clear out the enemy Engineers [re: Chinook+Ranger Combat Drop, Generals]).

Note that you can put Rifleman/Militant Squads in a building instead of an Engineering Team (to act as security), but doing so keeps the building from operating at 100%. Every structure built comes with its maximum number of Engineering Teams (much as Troop Crawlers in Generals came with Red Guardsmen).

Con. Yard: 4 team max.
Power Plant: 1 team max.
Barracks/Hand of Nod: 1 team max.
Radar: 2 team max.
War Factory: 3 team max.
Tech Center: 5 team max.

Therefore, a War Factory manned by 2 Engineering Teams would operate at 67% efficiency, taking half-and-again as long to produce the same units. I have seriously reconsidered this idea. Instead of Engineering Teams consisting of Engineers, they should consist of "Technicians" (yes, those Technicians) and might have another name. Engineers repair friendly structures and capture Husks, Tech Structures, and abandoned enemy structures. Engineering Teams (new name needed?) man friendly structures and captured enemy structures.

AugustSonereal

08-19-2007, 04:25 PM

Which idea?
All of them actually

Or, we could just re-add Tiberium Veins. Also, making Tiberium destructive would discourage expansion, it would be disadvantageous to send your Harvesters, which are your only defense against the growing plague, off to harvest another field.
Ah, veins wold be a nice touch, but harversters weren't the only defense in this game (CNC3). Superweapons would do damage, plus some other weapons. The Sonic Resonator seems like it doesn't do nothing to the stuff though (despite it supposed creation was because it could break the cyrstal)

If Tiberium grows more rapidly, it will make expansion less important. Perhaps instead of cutting Tiberium's value to 1/3, it could be cut to 1/6 but the Harvester's load size is doubled (so each Harvester takes in only 1/3 the original load value but has to harvest twice as many crystals to do so). This would cause the player to "deplete" Tiberium fields more rapidly and thus require greater expansion efforts.

This seems like the best idea, since a supereweapon can be built after 2 loads, and the mammoth after 1 (10 harvesters=10 ungodly mammoths, plus the Rail gun)

One Superweapon, total, out of all the options, or one of each? One total seems like a good idea and would force the Player to make some interesting choices.

Out of all of the choices. Making players having to decide whether they want to risk getting a weaker superweapon earlier, to try to take out an enemy while his base is young, or gambling with a stronger weapon that has the stopping power nesscary to knoch stronger players of their perch.

Maybe. On the other hand, a light vehicle like a Pitbull or Raider Buggy would probably be too badly damaged to be field-salvaged anyway.

Which makes it odd that a engineer could repair an entire bridge and building in an instance, but a simple missle launching jeep is too much for them. Maybe the engineer could savage anything that takes more than 10 seconds to build? Because a mammoth tank costs more and takes longer than a Juggernaut, but a juggernaut is the one getting special attention.

That might be a good idea. Then again, power plants can be sold to acquire infantry, so that doesn't work 100%.

Making it so that what comes out of a destroyed building makes sense? If anything, engineers should come running out of a destroyed power plant, and not infantry. I'll do that instead of the all unit thing.

Needs ASAP: New Visceroid (the blob, the blob I tell you!), Tiberium Fiends, Tiberium Floaters, and more variety in the Tiberium Mutants. Other Tiberium Lifeforms would also be a treat.
Great, the ones we have now seem too.....tame.

Interesting idea. The current setup might make Nod's basic infantry overpowered (a $200 squad able to cause a large group of enemies to slaughter one another).

I have seriously reconsidered this idea. Instead of Engineering Teams consisting of Engineers, they should consist of "Technicians" (yes, those Technicians) and might have another name. Engineers repair friendly structures and capture Husks, Tech Structures, and abandoned enemy structures. Engineering Teams (new name needed?) man friendly structures and captured enemy structures.

Yes, Engineers need a union too, lol. Buildings need workers. (Could stop infantry and mammoth rush)

Quadhelix

08-19-2007, 09:10 PM

Superweapons would do damage, plus some other weapons. True, but it doesn't make much sense to use a superweapon to destroy your own Tiberium when the superweapon costs nearly three times a Harvester and can be used only once every seven minutes.

The Sonic Resonator seems like it doesn't do nothing to the stuff though (despite it supposed creation was because it could break the cyrstal) There is a very good reason for this (http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/GameplayAndStorySegregation) (i.e., the Sonic Resonators are MacGuffins (http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/MacGuffin) for the Scrin to destroy).

Which makes it odd that a engineer could repair an entire bridge and building in an instance, but a simple missle launching jeep is too much for them. True, but IIRC, the Engineer merely operates the bridge's own autorepair system (to some extent, at least). As for being unable to repair a "missile launching jeep," it's kind hard to repair a vehicle that consists of nothing more than a few scattered scraps of metal ;).

Maybe the engineer could savage anything that takes more than 10 seconds to build? Maybe. Or maybe tanks like the Predator and Scorpion could leave a husk with 1/3 max health and mechs and "heavy tanks" (i.e., Mammoth Tanks) leave a husk with 2/3 max health.

Because a mammoth tank costs more and takes longer than a Juggernaut, but a juggernaut is the one getting special attention. True, but that's because Juggernauts are mechs and mechs are cool.:D

Seriously though, I was simply suggesting that perhaps husks should be limited to tanks and heavier.

____________________________________________________________________________________

Edit 1:

The Project Perfect Mod article (http://www.ppmsite.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=15742) on the announcement of Kane's Wrath speculated that this (http://www.ppmsite.com/newspic/kanewrath_mobilegen.jpg) might be a Mobile Stealth Generator. Now that we have received confirmation that it is, in fact, a Reckoner APC, I would like to suggest the addition of a Mobile Stealth Generator.

Given that Nod has had nearly twenty years since the Firestorm crisis to improve the technology, I would like to suggest several improvements over its Firestorm counterpart:1. Stealth Truck: The MSG itself is cloaked while mobile, allowing it position itself without forewarning to the enemy. Balance wise, this is justified by the presence of cheap detector for each side.

2. Stealth Inversion Ability: While mobile, the MSG can decloak in order to cloak nearby units. As with the vanilla Disruption Tower and Starcraft's Arbiter, MSGs using this ability cannot cloak one another, nor can they be cloaked by any other means. MSGs can maintain a cloak inversion for thirty seconds before they have to recharge (if the Stealth Inversion ability is deactivated before its charge is depleted, it will take twice as long as it was in use to recharge).
Also, with it now revealed that the Awakened, the new Nod Cyborg infantry, have EMP cannon, it is especially important for GDI infantry to gain an EMP weapon of their own (especially given that GDI developed the Mobile EMP before Nod).

Interestingly, the Awakened are almost an inversion of the Cyborg Reaper: the Cyborg Reaper is effectively a vehicle and is armed with anti-vehicle weaponry, but has a special weapon to disable infantry; the Awakened are effectively infantry and are armed with anti-infantry weaponry, but have a special weapon to disable vehicles. As such, re-adding Cyborg Reapers would be an interesting complement to the new Cyborg infantrymen.

____________________________________________________________________________________

Edit 2:

Similar to the idea here (http://www.ppmsite.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=15185) and the Terran Siege Tank from Starcraft, give Mammoth Tanks the ability to deploy into a stationary quasi-structure to increase it its range and firepower. Unlike those two, however, this Mammoth Bunker will work more like a Surveyor, in that its deployment takes a fair deal of time, although it can undeploy instantly. Deployed Mammoth Tanks could have repair drones like a deployed Rig and perhaps have individual upgrades for thicker armor that makes the "Mammoth Turret" permanently immobile.

New Unit: Paladin Tank ($2,000-$3,000). Only slightly related to the tank of the same name in Generals, Paladin Tanks require a Tech Center to build and are armed with a single Railgun. In fact, un-upgraded Paladin Tanks are functionally equivalent to Predator Tanks that have received the Railgun upgrade. However, once the Railgun upgrade has been researched, Paladin Tanks become far more deadly, gaining a significant range and firepower increase at the cost of a slight reduction in its rate of fire. Furthermore, after the Railgun upgrade has been researched, the increased power in the Paladin Tank's firing coils creates a power EMP that scrambles enemy missiles when the Paladin fires.

____________________________________________________________________________________

Edit 3:

Changes to the defenses would include replacing the Guardian Cannon and AA Battery with an Advanced Guard Tower, equipped with anti-tank/anti-aircraft missiles, and removing Nod's Shredder turret while making the Laser Turret slightly stronger against infantry.

Additionally, Outposts should have a $1,000 upgrade that attaches a Crane/Foundry to them, giving them a build queue. With the recent 1.07 Patch removing the defense tab from Cranes and Foundries, perhaps They could have a $500 upgrade to regain their defense tab (a Crane + a Surveyor costs $3,000, $500 more than a GDI MCV and with less functionality, even with the defense tab; removing the defense tab makes the Crane worth even less). Perhaps the "Combat Crane" upgrade does not allow the construction of advanced defenses (such as Sonic Emitters, Obelisks of Light, or Storm Columns) nor superweapons.

Henners

08-25-2007, 11:11 PM

I just wish they could hurry up with the modding tools, notibly the config/unit/building editing stuff. :grumpy:

Once those tools are out, I'm sure there would be a plethora of third party editing tools.

Yeah :) I'm currently asking Tibed what they are going to do.. but so far they dont know what they are planning on getting 'round the .xml files..Just wanted to know what some members will modify when C & C 3 comes out.

I'll most likely do the following things:

- Increase the amount of Tiberium Silos can hold (It gets annoying when every couple of minutes "Silos Needed" plays)
- Have the Avatar Warmech's Laser fire continuously, like the beam cannon's.
- Increase the Stealth Tank's attack range (Going to have it be like a stealthed artillery :D)
- Reduce or rid the cost for the special abilities (I may do something else.)
- Increase Nod's nuke damage range.

And other bits and pieces.

How will you mod the game?

How will you do that? ^^ I tried simply changing the cost of gdi refinery & nothing happened when running the mod *shrug*I could tell you what I will do once the editing tools come out officially..

Increase Construction Yard health
Increase power output by 400-500% (Why? Cause I don't like a ton of power plants cluttering up my base)
Double reactor upgrade output
Reduce speed, increase damage of Nod Fanatics
Slightly decrease Scrin shielding
Increase tiberium and spread value
Increase Refinery and Silo capacity dramatically
Increase harvester health
Increase health of anti-infantry defenses
Increase autobuild time on Nod turrets
Increase aircraft speed slightly
Kill the shroud (easy to do, give the CY a vision of 9999, as you could in Gen/ZH):))
Increase damage for infantry anti-armor weapons
Increase timers for support powers and superweapons (Why? 7 minutes is not long enough. Personally, I would set it to 20 or 30 minutes)
Decrease price on most everything
Increase spread for shockwave artillery
Increase efficiency of small arms vs infantry

how will you do that? ^^ I tried simply changing the cost of gdi refinery & nothing happens with that *shrug*

Quadhelix

08-26-2007, 05:04 PM

The C&C: Retarded (http://projectcrit.blogspot.com/) mod has some ideas that could be useful in a "serious" mod (I put "serious" in quotation marks because the person who is making C&C: Retarded is very serious about making a mod that is fun to play; it is, however, difficult to take a mod seriously when it has the word "Retarded" in its name). Among these ideas are:
Giving Engineers repair drones to heal nearby vehicles. While he suggests this for all Saboteurs and Assimilators, I feel that it would fit best on the GDI Engineer, as he lacks the special abilities (such as the Saboteur's Booby Traps or the Assimilator's cloaking device). I know that GDI already has the Rig/Battle Base, but the GDI Engineer seriously needs some ability to justify costing the same as a Saboteur or Assimilator.
Give MCV's the ability to run over the units that a Mammoth Tank can (which makes sense, given that MCVs are bigger than Mammoth Tanks).
A Command Power allowing one side to create a Tiberium Crater. Might be a good enhancement (researchable upgrade?) for Nod's Seed Tiberium ability.
He suggests a $5000 upgrade to turn mini-MCVs into full MCVs. In hindsight, that suggestion might have subconsciously inspired my idea for the Crane upgrade for Outposts, however I would like to refine this idea. The closest that I would like to a conversion of mini-MCV to full MCV is the ability for mini-MCVs to deploy instantly. The Crane upgrade would give them their own build queue as well, but would have to be purchased at each individual Outpost.Another idea inspired by the mini-MCV to full-MCV upgrade is the possibility that the basic Con Yard cannot build certain things, such as Armories/Secret Shrines/Stasis Chambers, Airfields/Air Towers/Gravity Stabilizers, Tech Centers/Tech Labs/Technology Assemblers, and any structure that requires those buildings.

In order to build those structures, the Construction Yard must have researched the $1,000 "Construction Center" upgrade. In addition to allowing access to the more advanced branches of the tech tree, a Construction Center has 50% more health than a Construction Yard at the cost of permanent immobility. Although Cranes can build the the advanced structures that a Construction Yard cannot, the advanced structures have the Construction Center as a prerequisite anyway.

I also have several other ideas, such as doubling the Sniper Teams size (2 Snipers, 1 Spotter, and 1 EMP Operative), allowing the Battle Base to serve as a field equivalent of the Armory, and changes to several upgrades.

In Summary:New Upgrades
Outpost Crane/Foundry ($750): Researched at each Outpost, this upgrade gives the Outpost its own build queue.
Battle Crane/Foundry ($500): Researched at each Crane/Foundry/upgraded Outpost, this upgrade gives the Crane/Foundry/Outpost the ability to build pre-tech center support structures. [Edit: possible changes to Cranes/Foundries to fix base crawling problem by other means; see below]
Construction Center ($1,000): Researched at each Construction Yard, converts the Construction Yard into a Construction Center, which has 50% more health and the ability to build more advanced structures but lacks the ability to repack into an MCV.

Upgrade Changes
Tiberium Infusion: Instead of making Nod infantry immune to Tiberium, this upgrade allows Nod infantry to heal in Tiberium. [Edit: see below]
Composite Armor: This upgrade gives GDI infantry stronger armor and more health, as with the original, but also gives them short-term immunity to the poisonous effects of Tiberium (good for Red Zone maps).

Unit Changes
GDI Engineer: Possesses a single vehicle repair drone.
Battle Base: Acts as a mobile version of the armory; a single infantry squad can be placed inside and will come back out at full health.
Sniper Team: Has an extra sniper and a new operative that carries a backpack-mounted EMP-Blast Generator, which is functionally identical to the Raider Buggy's EMP Coils. [Edit: see below]
Raider Buggy and Attack Bike: Lower the Attack Bike's cost and give its anti-stealth ability to the Raider Buggy, which should loose it AA ability until the Laser Capacitor upgrade has been purchased.
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Edit:

After reading through the Kane's Wrath Ideas (http://forums.ea.com/mboards/thread.jspa?threadID=254259&start=0&tstart=0) thread on the EA Support "Forums" (the correct plural of "forum" is "fora," or it was two thousand years ago), I found several ideas that are fairly interesting. Although they may be included in Kane's Wrath, they would be great modding ideas if not included.

For example, kyanges suggests that all stealth detection be of the "Sensor Pulse" type and scorpionplyr1... suggests that stealth detection be reduced to tier 1 defenses, AA defenses (only able to detect planes), MSAs, Commando units, and a sensor pulse ability on pitbull/attack bikes/seekers. This is moderately similar to my earlier suggestion (http://forums.cncden.com/showpost.php?p=343170&postcount=64) to make Stealth Tanks harder to detect (i.e., make Stealth Tanks immune to detection from "normal detectors," which will still sound alarm if a Stealth Tank is present but not tell exactly where the Stealth Tank is; in order to pinpoint and destroy a Stealth Tank, you must either wait for it to fire or use the new MSA's Sensor Pulse).

Crysisfanatic suggests, as do I, giving Battle Bases the same infantry healing abilities as the Armory. He also suggests an upgrade for Predator Tanks giving them missiles similar to the Mammoth Tank's, a suggestion that was shot down because it made the Predator too useful, effectively ending the need for Pitbulls and APCs; I made a similar suggestion a while ago, but with a difference: Mammoth Tanks and Predator Tanks would get their missile from the same upgrade, the missiles would be poor against infantry, and Railgun upgrade would not be compatible with the Missile upgrade (i.e., you could upgrade your tanks with anti-aircraft/anti-tank missiles or with infantry-slaughtering railguns, but not both). He also suggests an upgrade for the Firehawk giving it Thermobaric "Bunker Buster" Bombs and another upgrade giving the Juggernaut cluster munitions. Finally, he suggest the name "Stalker" for Nod's Mobile Stealth Generator, a name that seems appropriate (although I have an idea to make it seem even more appropriate).

New Unit Suggestions (Mostly mine; I already mentioned theirs):Mobile Sensor Array: each side gets a Rig-type unit capable of detecting cloaked units within a fairly large radius.GDI MSA-Rig (?): Add long-range stealth detection to the Battle Base (at least as far, if not farther, than its current weapon's range); remove the two cannon but allow its AA missiles to ht ground targets, and perhaps give them a 2x RoF bonus against cloaked targets.

Nod MSA-Stalker: When deployed, this unit has a short range cloaking field, but a long-range stealth detection ability. Although arguably unbalanced because it is the only MSA to be cloaked, it looses most of its value as an MSA when playing against GDI or the Scrin, as those two factions have little in the way of cloaked units; also, it would come far later on the Tech Tree than the other MSAs (requiring a Tech Lab and a Disruption Tower , as opposed to an Operations Center).

Scrin MSA-Nerve Hub: When deployed detects stealth at long range and provides a rate of fire bonus to units attacking enemies within its detection range. [Edit: see below]
Devil's Fang Tank (Nod): A tank armed with a anti-tank/anti-structure thermite flamethrower, which is actually rather weak against infantry. While the Devil's Fang has relatively poor armor and short range, it is capable of capable of switching between above surface and subterranean operations in much the same manner as Shadow Teams are capable of switching between ground and aerial operations. While subterranean, a Devil's Fang Tank is still vulnerable to GDI sonic weaponry and, with the direction of Stalkers on the surface, is capable of flanking enemy Devil's Fang Tanks to attack them with its digging equipment. A Devil's Fang Tank is capable of hold one infantry squad, which must evacuate the vehicle to attack.

Vertigo: Although this is not a new unit, it would be nice to give it some new abilities to show its (or give it) Banshee ancestry. For example, it could be given a weapons switch like the Firehawk that allows it to trade in its demolition bomb for five Plasma Bursts, like the Stormrider's weapon in burst form with limited ammo, that are useful against tanks but not buildings.

Mammoth Tank: Remove its missiles, but give them back after researching the "Tank Missiles" upgrade, which gives similar missiles to Predator Tanks (basically making Predator Tanks 1/2 a Mammoth Tank). However, the new missiles are very weak against infantry and the Player cannot research both the Missile and the Railgun upgrades.

Pitbull: Give it an ECM ability to jam enemy missiles targeting it. Although useless against tanks, it would help the Pitbull against enemy rocket infantry and give the Pitbull an advantage against its natural prey: Stealth Tanks.

Corrupter: Automatically "attacks" damaged friendlies that are within firing range. Only those that would benefit, of course.

Infantry: A major overhaul may or may not be beneficial. Experimentation is necessary.Rifleman and Militant Squads: Reduce cost to $120 (Riflemen) or $80 (Militants) per squad. Also, the two squads should be of the same size (six [Edit: 5] soldiers and one Commander).

Rocket Squads: Lower the cost to $350, triple the number of rocketmen [increase squad size to 5 rocket men], reduce the individual rocketman's RoF to 75%, and add a Commander.

Grenadier Squads: Give the Grenadiers a [I]Generals' Ranger-esque weapon switch ability, allowing them to change between anti-infantry grenades and anti-tank grenades. The anti-infantry grenades can be upgraded to clear out garrisoned structures and the anti-tank grenades can be upgraded to have a minor EMP effect. Lower their cost to $600, add two [Edit: one] more Grenadiers (for a total of 6 [5]) and a Commander.

Purifier Squads: A new, $350 nod infantry squad consisting of a Commander leading six [Edit: five] soldiers with flamethrowers, which can be upgraded to Tiberium-sprayers once the Tiberium Infusion upgrade has been researched (FYI, Tiberian Eclipse (http://www.ppmsite.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=15185) has a Chemspray upgrade for the Black Hand that lets them clear vehicles; should upgraded Purifiers have that ability?).

Sniper Teams: Sniper Teams are camouflaged, not cloaked, and therefore are immune to detectors such as Pitbulls and defense turrets. Other infantry, however, can detect the Sniper Team if they get too close. Firing does not reveal the Sniper Team's position, but they do experience a severe RoF reduction because of their enhanced stealth abilities. If possible, their visibility should be dependent on the terrain (they have trouble hiding on flat, barren terrain or on open roads, but can hide easily in the grassy savanna or in woodsy areas). [Edit: see below]

Black Hand Squad: In addition to their flamethrowers, Black Hand Troopers also carry a man-portable version of the laser turret's weapon (shorter range and less damage), are highly resistant to sniper fire and immune to Tiberium and Confessor Hallucination Grenades, and cost $1,100.

Zone Troopers: Railgun damage increased +200% with a RoF decrease of -75%, resulting in an overall damage decrease of -25%. To compensate for the lower RoF, Zone Troopers are equipped with an auxiliary machine gun which they use while their railguns recharge as well as having an additional two troopers in each squad. Given that their air supply is completely internal, they are immune to Confessor Hallucination Grenades.

Commander: Not its own unit, but an extra unit in several infantry squads (specifically: Rifleman/Militant, Rocketman, Grenadier, and Purifier). Commanders give nearby their squad a +25% RoF bonus (or rather, loosing its Commander give the squad a -20% RoF penalty). Also, infantrymen in squads without a Commander will pick their targets far more independently: when not ordered to attack a specific target, they will each attack different enemies; if a Commander is present, however, all infantrymen in his squad will fire on his target. Commanders wear far heavier armor than other infantry, enabling them to survive three or four shots from enemy snipers before going down, although they carry only a GD-2 Assault Rifle (http://cnc.wikia.com/wiki/GD-2) (which is the same weapon used by Riflemen).
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Edit 2:

More IdeasInfantry Changes, Continued: More experimentation will be necessary to determine whether or not these changes are beneficial.Shadow Teams: Like Sniper Teams, Shadow Teams derive their stealthiness from cautious movements and exploitation of advantageous terrain. Unlike Sniper Teams, however, Shadow Teams have the benefit of Lazarus Shield technology; if no cover is available, such as when the Shadow Team is in flight, they will engage their cloaking device in order to remain concealed. However, they will not engage their cloaking technology if they can remain concealed without it, as the Lazarus Shield acts almost as a beacon to Detector units, such as GDI's Pitbull, revealing the Shadow Team's location when it might otherwise have remained concealed.

Sniper Team: Due for a cost reduction to about $650, due to the Shadow Team's superior stealth abilities and the reduced cost of other infantry types. Also, as mentioned earlier add a second Sniper and an EMP-Coil Technician, but weaken/remove the Spotter's weapon.
Ranger Squad: A unit partially inspired the "Marine Commander (http://www.d2kstudios.com/tiberium/TO/features/gdiinf.html)" in the upcoming Tiberian Odyssey (http://www.d2kstudios.com/tiberium/) mod for Tiberian Sun. Ranger Squads are effectively Rifleman Squads equipped with the same Demolition Charges as Nod's Shadow Teams. When immobile, Ranger Squads are generally capable of using their covert training to conceal themselves from nearby enemies, although infantry can generally spot them if they get close enough and Ranger Squads' weapons are not silenced, so they are detected far more easily when they attack. Ranger Squads are available only through reinforcement powers.

Component Tower: A semi-classic GDI defensive structure, Component Towers now come with an internal assembly module that allows them to construct their own armaments without burdening the Construction Yard. Component Towers can be upgraded with one of several weapons: 1. Vulcan Pod: dual version of the APC's machine gun, making it highly effective against infantry and aircraft.
2. Grenade Launcher Pod: effective against both vehicles and infantry, although suffers from inaccuracy at longer ranges.
3. Missile Pod: can target ground and air units, making it effective against both tanks and aircraft.
4. SAM Pod: double the range of the Missile Pod and able to detect cloaked aircraft, but unable to target ground units.
5. Sensor Pod: doubles the Component Tower's sight range and enables it to detect cloaked units.
6. Firestorm Emitter Pod: when the Firestorm Generator is activated, all Firestorm Emitters within range of one another will link together to form a sonic forcefield.
Component Center: The idea for this structure is derived from the Upgrade Center idea on the now inert Tiberian Graveyard (http://graveyards.cncguild.net/style.php?page=downl) website's GDI page (http://graveyards.cncguild.net/style.php?page=gdi). The Component Center has four (4) slots for upgrades, built at the Component Center itself, that can provide power, command abilities, etc. They effectively take the place of Power Plants, as the best design would be to have them provide about 5 units of power with all of the rest coming from the attached upgrades. Possible upgrades include:1. Power Turbine: obvious, given its position as a Power Plant. Each Power Turbine upgrade provides five units of power and occupies one upgrade slot.
2. Advance Power Turbine: the next step up from a regular Power Turbine. Each Advanced Power Turbine upgrade provides ten units of power and occupies one upgrade slot. Requires a Tech Center.
3. C3 Post: provides a map-wide +5% RoF bonus. Each C3 Post upgrade draws five units of power and occupies two upgrade slots. Requires a Command Post.
4. Reinforcement Relay: allows Player to order off map reinforcements, such as the Bloodhounds or Sharpshooter Teams. Each Reinforcement Relay upgrade draws five units of power and occupies two upgrade slots. Requires a Command Post.
5. EMP Uplink: based on a similar upgrade in the upcoming Tiberian Odyssey (http://www.d2kstudios.com/tiberium/TO/features/gdistruc.html) mod, the EMP Uplink is a Player-built version of the EMP Bunker. Each EMP upgrade draws fifteen units of power and occupies two upgrade slots. Requires a Command Post.
6. Firestorm Generator: converts the Component Center into a Firestorm Generator. The Firestorm Generator upgrade draws fifty units of power and uses all four upgrade slots. Requires a Tech Center.
7. Ion Cannon Control Center: allows the Player to construct the Ion Cannon Uplink. The Ion Cannon Control Center upgrade draws ten units of power and uses all four upgrade slots. Requires a Tech Center.
Nod Power Plant and Advanced Power Plant: Although I have been enamored of the idea of the aforementioned Component Center, I have also like that the GDI Power Plant was structurally reminiscent of TW1-era Power Plants and was loath to recommend a change until I found inspiration (actually, a metaphorical boot to the face) on the Nod Structures (http://www.d2kstudios.com/tiberium/TO/features/nodstruc.html) page at the Tiberian Odyssey (http://www.d2kstudios.com/tiberium/) website: give Nod a re-texture of GDI's current Power Plant and model Nod's new Advance Power Plant around two regular Power Plants fused together. Although this would, ethically, require the permission of the Tiberian Odyssey team, honest imitation is the sincerest form of flattery and the TO team deserves a lot of kudos for their work :D.

Nerve Hub: The Scrin's aforementioned MSA-equivalent. In addition to its ability to enhance targeting against enemies within its detection range, it is also capable of opening a wormhole connection to any point with friendly ground control, with itself as one of the endpoints, sort of like a two-way, semi-permanent version of the Arbiter's Recall ability in Starcraft (Feedback on this, please).

Tunnel Networks: Nod can construct special Bunkers that can hold infantry or tanks and are highly resistant to attack. However, Nod can also use its Subterranean technology to build tunnels between these Bunkers. Units moving through the tunnels behave just as Subterranean units do, except that they cannot stray from the path of the tunnel and cannot resurface except at one of the destination Bunkers. Note that units can be ordered to hold their position within the tunnels and that if the enemy captures one of the Bunkers, they can send their units into your Tunnel Network. The tunnels themselves are built somewhat like wall.

Cranes: A potential improvement to the Crane is to re-add its defense tab and solve the problem EA had with it through other means: give the Crane the same ground control as a Construction Yard but prohibit it from building structures outside its own ground control and Cranes themselves can be placed only within the ground control of Construction Yards, Construction Centers, Expansion Points, and Outposts (perhaps give it the ability to build [non-defensive?] structures within the ground control of these other structures). This would, of course, eliminate the need for the aforementioned "Battle Crane" upgrade.

Trencher Tank: Similar to Nod's MBT from Tiberian Sun and the Siege Tank from Starcraft., the Trencher Tank is the perfect complement to the Reckoner APC. Armed with dual 105mm cannon (or Spitfire lasers after the upgrade) and costing more than a GDI Predator, this tank is nonetheless only on par with the Scorpion in terms of strength, lacking in armor what it gains in a second barrel. It can, however, deploy for varying lengths of time to make use of its 200mm cannon, allowing it some extra degree of strength; when thusly deployed, it also releases a single Repair Drone, mostly for self-repair but also benefiting nearby friendlies. Also, it can deploy permanently by burying its fragile chassis into the ground, leaving only only the highly armored turret above ground, allowing it use of its 200mm cannon and a great deal of "extra" armor at the cost of mobility. By virtue of their digging equipment, Trencher Tanks come effectively equipped with Dozer Blades.

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Edit 3:

Yet More Ideas:Orca Upgrades: There have been quite a few requests for either a Chain Gun on the Orca or a an upgrade to add on. However, concept art (http://www.cnc-source.com/forums/index.php?automodule=gallery&req=si&img=4402) for C&C3 indicates that the Orca was originally intended to have a good deal of upgrades, including a machine gun, a plethora of extra missiles on extra pods and embedded in the wings, improved engines, flares, an EMP weapon, and extra fuel tanks.

Hopper Mines: Apparently, the Limpet Mine (http://www.cnc-source.com/forums/index.php?automodule=gallery&req=si&img=2616) was originally supposed to act as a one use missile mine as opposed to the current version, which acts as like a mine version of the C&C3 Orca's Sensor Pod. Nod, being the sneaky people that they are, probably would have realized that as good a scout unit a limpet mine makes, it suffers from an over dependence on luck and is far too easy to disable once attached to an enemy vehicle. Thus, they began making upgrades. After many failed attempts, they recently were able to modify the delivery system sufficiently to enable relatively secure delivery: when an enemy vehicle gets within range, a the sensor package is delivered to the target by a cloaked micro-mech (think Terror Drone) launched within a short-range SSM. With the most pressing issue solved, Nod researchers began looking into ways to prevent removal of the sensor package. After much research, they decided to install a small Vinifera based self-destruct, which could be triggered either at a remote command or by an attempt to remove the drone and was capable of doing severe dame both to the probed unit and any surrounding forces. Recently, Nod scientists have begun research into methods of upgrading the self-destruct with a liquid Tiberium based Catalyst bomb, although such technology has not yet appeared on field models.

New Mutants:According to this source (http://www.petroglyphgames.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=2554&pid=49372&mode=threaded&start=#entry49372) and this source (http://www.petroglyphgames.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=2554&pid=53496&mode=threaded&start=#entry53496), the Forgotten were to have developed special Tiberium based powers that even the Scrin lacked. All of the following units heal in Tiberium.Mutant Trainer: Purchasable from the Mutant Hovel, these sturdy Mutants are armed with only a light machine gun, but make up for their weak weapons with the "allies" that they can collect over the battlefield. They possess the ability to recruit creatures such as Tiberium Fiends by approaching them and acting with kindness but not fear (Note: this is an ability, like Shadow Team's Demo Charges and Orca's Sensor Pulse, not an innate effect).

Mutant Seer: Purchasable from the Mutant Hovel, this "infantryman," if such a term applies to these sages and soothsayers, have innate link to the Tiberium that has twisted their bodies into forms barely recognizable as human. They possess an ability similar to the Scrin's Tiberium Vibration Scan as well as sharing sight with any non-Scrin Tiberium-based lifeform on the map. They also have the ability to create a short but destructive Ion Storm anywhere on the map, although this takes a great deal of concentration and they cannot do it very often. Mutant Seers are so dependent on Tiberium that they take damage when not in a Tiberium Field. The Player is limited to one Mutant Seer at time.
Nod Priest: The basic idea comes from this concept art (http://www.cnc-source.com/forums/index.php?automodule=gallery&req=si&img=3939). Nod Priests are among the the most fanatical of Nod's members. In addition to providing friendly Nod infantry in their vicinity a +25% RoF bonus, their devotion allows them to act as platforms for Nod's newest subversion technology and are able to make short term use of an ability similar to mind control. Unlike the Scrin Mastermind, Nod Priests can control their target for only a few short minutes - after which both the Nod Priest and their victim die [Edit: no] - and must remain within range of their victim. Also, while killing the Nod Priest frees the victim, killing the victim also kills the Nod Priest. Finally, although the Nod Priests can switch from controlling one enemy to another, doing so does not give them a fresh countdown; once a Nod Priest has used his mind control ability, he [I]will die [Edit: will have to recharge the ability; see below] within several minutes. Due to the importance of Nod Priests to the Brotherhood, no unit controlled by a Nod Player can attack a Nod Priest, not even via forced fire (exceptions may be made for campaign missions). [Edit: see below]

Tiberium Infusion: Instead of merely making infantry immune to Tiberium or giving them Tiberium-healing, this upgrade could be a bit more complex. Infantrymen upgraded with Tiberium Infusion still suffer damage from Tiberium, but the damage is significantly reduced and heals incredibly quickly after they leave the Tiberium field. However, the Tiberium continues to accumulate in their system and after enough exposure (enough to drain about four times their max health), the infantrymen achieve Divination, becoming Tiberium Mutants (i.e., a Militia Squad becomes a Mutant Militia Squad) able to heal in Tiberium. Due to the semi-experimental nature of the new Divination technique, the infantrymen turn into Visceroids upon their death. [Edit: that is to say, the Mutant infantry turn into Visceroids upon their deaths; regular Tiberium Infused infantry do not, also expanded below]

Tiberium Growth: Assassin at Tiberian Sun: Rising has come up with an excellent method of Tiberium growth (http://www.cnc-source.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=5666&view=findpost&p=46009). Summarized, it goes something like this: if left unharvested for too long, Tiberium Riparius (green) crystals will explode into shards that form Tiberium Vinifera (blue). Those Vinifera crystals, if left alone for too long will form large Tiberium Cruentus crystals that explode and scatter Tiberium Vinifera spores over large distances.

Mobile Extractor: Given that the Scrin forces were intended to be a harvesting operation, they designed most of their equipment to aid them in their task. One such piece of equipment is the Mobile Extractor. This airborne cruiser coasts above the battlefield, observing the Harvesters at their work. when a Harvester is almost full, the Mobile Extractor makes its way over to the Harvester and uses a tractor beam to pick it up once it is full, placing the loaded Harvester in the Mobile Extractor's foreword extraction bay. Once the Harvester is in place, the Mobile Extractor acts much the same as its stationary counterpart. The Mobile Extractor also possess four docking lateral docking pylons, similar to those on Planetary Assault Carriers, at which Harvesters can dock as the Mobile Extractor moves from a depleted Tiberium field to a fresh one. The Mobile Extractor's weaponry consists of a single turret, about on par with a Gun Walker, and it can be upgraded with shields like the Devourer Warship and the Planetary Assault Carrier.

Orca Assault Platform: The descendant of the Orca Bomber and cousin to the Firehawk, Orca Assault Platforms fill a role occupied by neither. With the recent increase in urban warfare, Nod troops have begun to occupy civilian structures in order to attack GDI forces without worry of retaliation. The Orca Assault Platform was created in response to this threat. Heavily armored and armed with two duel heavy machine gun turrets, the Orca Assault Platform is able to keep the streets clean. If Nod infantry seek shelter in nearby civilian structures, the Orca Assault Platform can clear them out with its Thermobaric Bomb (Crysisfanatic recommended these as an upgrade for the Firehawk in Kane's Wrath here (http://forums.ea.com/mboards/message.jspa?messageID=2689157#2689157)). Orca Assault Platforms are also equipped with ECM systems that, while unable to jam the advanced guidance system used by SAM Sites and inefficient against the Missile used by Attack Bikes and Pitbulls (blocking only about half of them), it is quite capable of defending the Orca Assault Platform against Militant Rocket Squads (and Missile Squads, for that matter). ____________________________________________________________________________________

Edit 4(!):

Still Yet More Ideas:Nod Priest: Yes, I already mentioned this guy, but then I realized that I homeless person with a butter knife could do this guy's job better and would probably work for bread skins (remember that in TW3, Nod controls some of the most destitute nations on Earth), so this guy needs some serious beefing up to match his status as "loyalest of the loyal." First, in addition to their "Mastermind Lite" mind control abilities, they also have the ability to permanently convert units under the effect of Confessor Hallucinogenic Gas Grenades by being within relatively close proximity; the effect is total and not even killing the Nod Priest will free his enslaved victims. Fortunately, this ability requires the presence of a Temple of Nod on the battlefield and the Nod must get very close to his victims. Second, they do not die after having mind controlled an enemy, unless that enemy is killed; instead the Nod Priests merely must recharge their mind control ("Empathic Preaching") ability after having used it.
Empathic Preaching: This is the main ability of Nod Priests, the ability to completely control a single enemy for a short time. As long as the ability is engaged, the Nod Priest can mind control a different enemy, thus releasing whichever enemy they were controlling (basically, the Empathic Preaching ability gives the Nod Priest a mind control "weapon"; as long as the ability is active, the Nod Priest functions like a RA2 Yuri, with the restriction that mind controlled units cannot leave the mind control weapon's range). Once the ability's time is depleted, the Nod Priest's victim is freed. Although it can be used for up to three minutes, it can be disengaged at any time beforehand; the recharge time after the ability disengages is about 1/2 the time that the ability was engaged (so if you use it for all three minutes, it will take a minute and a half to recharge). Unlike the Firestorm Defense in TW2, the Empathic Preaching ability must be fully charged before it can be reengaged, even if it was disengaged before the full three minutes. Also, while the Empathic Preaching ability can be engaged at any time, its time limit does not start until the Nod Priest mind controls an enemy.
Impression: This ability, which has a recharge time of nearly five minutes, draws in five civilians from the surrounding area and converts them into Fanatics under the Player's control. If there are less than five civilians within this abilities range, one minute will be deducted from the delay of the next use (i.e., if there were only two civilians within range when this ability was activated, it would recharge in two minutes).Confessors: It makes little sense to give confessors to two of the cheapest units in the game (one of which is the cheapest unit in the game). Thus, I would suggest remove Confessors from Militant Squads and Militant Rocket Squads, and have the Confessor Upgrade add a Confessor to the Black Hand Squad.

Vinifera Slugs: To replace the loss of the Confessors in basic infantry squads, Nod researchers designed this deadly upgrade. Researched at the Secret Shrine, this weapon gives Militants powerful new Tiberium-based slugs that explode on impact, doing far more damage. Even if the target survives the impact, he/she now has Tiberium embedded in his/her flesh, causing minor damage over time and will probably turn into a Visceroid when killed; worse, if the victim enters a Tiberium field, he/she will die almost instantly. Tiberium Mutants and the Scrin, of course, don't suffer from the poisonous effects of these bullets, in fact, healing slightly over time after having been shot; however, the increased damage from the initial impact more than compensates for any incidental healing effects.

Fanatics: I forgot to mention this earlier, but with the reduction in infantry costs, I recommend a cost reduction to $500.

New Cyborg Tech: The Awakened from the upcoming Kane's Wrath are effectively TW2 Nod Cyborgs with an added EMP cannon. We do not yet know their back story and could have been harvested like CABAL's Cyborgs in Firestorm or Nod "volunteers" like in the original Tiberian Sun. Either way, the reintroduction of Cyborg technology opens some interesting possibilities.
Awakened Elite: After achieving Heroic rank, the Awakened can be sent to a Cyborg Production Plant to be upgraded to the Awakened Elite for $500. These battle hardened Cyborgs are armed with a duel plasma cannon and are capable of doing significant damage to both vehicles and aircraft. Due to the plasma cannon's low rate of fire, the Awakened Elite are vulnerable to large groups of infantry.

Cyborg Hijacker: Not so much a Cyborg as a hijacker with cybernetic implants to allow him to hack past the DNA and dog tag scanners (http://cnc.wikia.com/wiki/Pitbull) used to secure GDI vehicles. Cyborg Hijackers are general recruited from the poorest and most destitute of Nod's citizenry. Like all other Cyborgs, vulnerable to EMP but heals in Tiberium.
Cyro-Collector: Another extension of Nod's Cyborg technology this unit goes around collecting the corpses of both friendly and enemy infantry and preserving them in cryogenic storage tanks. They can then return to a Cyborg Production Plant to allow the fallen infantry to be converted into one of two unit types. Reanimate: These Cyborgs are constructed the remains of fallen Nod soldiers, given new life. The have the same veterancy as the (dead) infantrymen used to create them and are armed with a heavy machine gun and a rocket launcher. They cost $750 to produce.

Zombie: These Cyborgs are constructed from the remains of those who would oppose the Brotherhood. They have no independent will, existing only to serve Nod's cause, and are armed with C4 self-destruct mechanisms. They cost $400 to produce.Secret Shrine: After the Tiberium Infusion upgrade has been researched (if it uses the gradual mutation method mentioned earlier), Tiberium Infused infantry squads can be sent into the Secret Shrine (re: Armory) to receive a second Tiberium Infusion, granting them Divination (i.e., they become Mutants). This process takes about thirty seconds per squad.

Advanced Component Tower: The updated version of GDI's old Advanced Guard Tower. Armed with a Component Vulcan Pod and duel Missile Pods, the Advanced Component Tower can be upgraded with one additional Pod.
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Hopefully, someone will find these ideas helpful.

Wildfire

09-19-2007, 04:25 PM

Here goes my idea that I'm going to do.

1. A new way to win/collect resources. Basically, using something like the Tiberium Spikes, there will be scattered structures thta you hae to capture and hold in order to generate revenue, they can be destroyed as well so that no one has money.

2. also plan on having ways that money can be airlifted or something, just a though dunno fif i like (like supply thingy for USA in Generals)

3. Want to make it so in missions you hold points to win a map for a period of time, or u destroy the other side.

4. Stronger/Weaker Infantry. Make their weapons more potent but they die easier as well.

5. Real artillery, able to fire a long ways, only within sight range of course. Will make artillery like juggernaut/sniper combo but have more ways of doing so like H eli copters rifle squad etc, artilllery will be bigger part of game (like real life)

6. Bigger Air play, HAVE to have helicopters and or plans in order to win map, tanks will be powerful and more suceptible (cna't speel lol) to rockets than shells (like real life). I'd tell u the units i'd have bu that'd give awy my mod ;)

7. Fewer buildings, vehicles will be airlifted in onto a pad or something, infantry will parachute or be delivered, possibly for certain factions only. plans will be called in only and not controlled by player (like Act of War) but helicopters and VTOL jets will be controlled by player.

8. No Tiberium (my mod has no resource collecting)

9. Just a few of my units, here's one side :D If u know where I got it from u'll know the mod. No units names, descriptions only.

Infantry Unit #1 - Squad of 4, Rifles, Gren Launchers, which causes light damage to vehicles, and devastating to other inf squads only has 4 shots.

#2. Lugs hand held railgun, has boot thrusters and BERP armor ( :D ). Armor needs to recharge after a few hits or else railgun thursters and armor stop working. If close to infantry and punch & kill.

#3. 8 foot walking machine with 40mm grenades or rockets and a chaingun, can run up to 40mph and jump onto buildings with each. Needs to recharge after a while.

Air Vehicles:

bomber: Circles battlefield and can defend squads with diff weapons, AA & AG missiles and JSOW (smart p ig) bombs. Stealthed to enemy radar.

Unit 2: Can be controlled by infantry as protector with mini mav's and allows artillery to be spotted. by any infantry unit.

unit 3: can deliver 4 exo skeleton units or 1 walker onto field quickly from bomber.

Super Weapon: Can take out any enemy air units and missiles fired for 2 minute burst time.

Just a couple ideas, still working out concept.

My plans are to have 3 main sides basically.
USA
Russian
China

All have 3 sub factions that u can choose
USA - Army, HAWC, Marine
Russian - Russia, Iran, (can't figure out 3rd, need one that uses Russian Hardware, doens' thave to enemy of US)

Chinese - China, North Korea (NK), Taiwan or South Korea.

Since u can't make a real 4th, 5th 6th sides etc what I plan to do is have different cranes that u b uild in order to access the tech tree of the side you pick (basically, u wont know who ur fighting until that certain unit attacks u)

The Army will basically be the US army, strong vehicles and helicopters but intermediate infantry, and very weak with fast movers, as the army doesn't have 'em but can call in support but not very often (high timers)

The HAWC will be very high technically based with very few units but which are all powerful, so say like ur the army and you attack with 20 tanks, HAWC may need only 5-10 units to take 'em out. But they're pretty weak and can be beaten easily but they are also the best to rush with.

The Marines deploy quickly are highly mobile and are the best all around of all factions (basically beginner side, army is more intermediate and HAWC for advanced players) they have defenses that can be moved by certain infantry units or vehicles

Tell me what u think. I'm still putting together the Russian and Chinese sides, but basically The Russian's will be bullies, Russia will be powerful and able to field large armies but very weak in terms of armor (like scrin) Iran will rely more on espionage and feints in order to win, the 3rd one (if there one) should maybe be good with infantry. I dunno.

China will be able to field massive numbers of infantry (squad consist of 10 instead of 5) and overwelm but uses outdated technology with some newwer tech sprinkled in.

North Korea is sorta medium but uses nasty stuff to win (bio weapons, nukes etc dont' care for human life)

I'm thinking of basically have USA have 3, Russian & Chinese with 2.

Other sides may include India, Pakistan, Taiwan, South Korea, Egypt, Lybia, maybe something like Al Qadea like a corporation that exists everywhere but no where that relies on Mercenaries. (like this idea for 3rd russian & pakistan for 3rd chinese "India is allied with Russia") Let's see...maybe an African side like an African Conglomerate with diff countries contributing, no european countries though. Wha yall think, anything I could add? If you read the books let me know.

HawkEye1102002

10-08-2007, 05:42 PM

Hers one of my ideas

GDI
Zone Troopers railguns will be replaced with heavy ramjet rifles (Like in Renegade): Railguns are upgrades to replace ramjet rifles

Predator light tanks will have a ATGW missile pod upgrades

Railgun upgrades will be able to go through multiple units

Jugganaught walking tanks will be ark at a higher angle

Grenadier squad grenades will actively track their targets

GDI engineer will have a .45 pistol (as mentioned in the Intel in C&C3)

Orcas will have a machine gun

Firehawks can be equipped with a single machine gun for strafing infantry (and limited air-to-air combat)

Predator SPAAG, basically a GDI AA Gatling cannon on a Predator light tank chasse, can be upgraded with having a man in the turret as opposed to being totally automatonus, this will allow the Predator SPAAG to have a somewhat limited self defence against ground units

GDI Mobile Sensor array has a big detection radius and can detect Nod stealth tanks before they strike

Nod
Black hand will have two flame throwers (squad leaders) and four laser infantry

Laser upgrade for Nod Vehicles will not replace their primary weapons (due to GDI railguns are able to damage multiple units) so Nod vehicles are somewhat compensated for the power of GDI railguns

Squad of two chemical warriors

SAM truck so that Nod has a dedicated AA unit

Banshee Mk2, which (since it is based on Scrin technology) will be able to have the same advantages as the Scrin stormrider

Magna Stealth SSM is an 8 wheeled vehicle with one missile on its back, Nod Shadow teams can help spot for super range

Scrin
Orbital strike, calls from the Scrin fleet for multiple laser strikes on designated areas, good all-round but is meant for close support

Buzzer howitzer is a Scrin artillery system that can deliver buzzers at long range, but the howitzer bust fill up with buzzers

Other changes
Blue tiberium is volatile
Nods nukes leave radiation and have a bigger blast area
Would like to include randomly occurring Ion storms like in TS
More mutants, including shiners (Who are not as deformed as the Marauders and live in old villages, cities and towns)
Wall hubs, walls and gates