1.05c released!!!

[Daishi]

After a long wait, the community balance patch v1.05c by GameReplays.org has been released!

Original discussion thread (http://www.gamereplays.org/community/index.php?showtopic=231191)
Full Changelog (http://www.gamereplays.org/cncreplays/task.php?nameid=changelog) from official patch v1.04

Featuring: The Scud bug getting fixed! :D

[SgtRicko]

Jeez, they still nerfed the KRs:grumpy:

[Derek]

Wow, that took a long time. Glad they got it out though. I still wish it were possible to play with it outside of CW's though.

[SgtRicko]

And another thing: terror cars now only do 200 damage instead of 700: that's just f***ed up man, it means that the damn things are near useless now!

[Derek]

And another thing: terror cars now only do 200 damage instead of 700: that's just f***ed up man, it means that the damn things are near useless now!
No, it means that it now takes 2 terror cars to kill a dozer. 700 was doing massive overkill to the terrorcars primary targets: Dozers and supply trucks. I remember the discussion on this, by changing the damage to 200 one terror car will leave a dozer in red, making it very vulnerable to follow ups, but not killing it. The intention is to make it so that GLA can't kill both of China's dozers right off the bat, they can easily kill one or critically weaken two, but then they would need to follow up to finish them off before they repaired.

[SgtRicko]

Actually, I used terror cars to mainly attack USA and GLA players, not China (BMs and Gatts usually pwn terror cars). The tactic worked best against distracted Humvees and scorps, sometimes techincals as well, but with this change, the strats I had with terror cars are pretty much gonna go out the window now.:\

[Me Myself & Pi]

Does anyone know when all the players that come on to generals online will get the patch when they get on? I other words, how long will it be bofore the patch will automaticly install when player log on to generals online?

[SgtRicko]

Won't happen. This is an unofficial patch, so EA won't use it.

[Me Myself & Pi]

I see, well thank you.

[Daishi]

Actually, I used terror cars to mainly attack USA and GLA players, not China (BMs and Gatts usually pwn terror cars). The tactic worked best against distracted Humvees and scorps, sometimes techincals as well, but with this change, the strats I had with terror cars are pretty much gonna go out the window now.:\

At the pro level, the only real terrorcar strat except in GLA mirrors is to attack the middle, grab the cars and and strike the player where it hurts. This happens very fast and early and can ruin China players before they get their factories up. (USA can LL or use chinooks to get away from the cars) while China's stretchy early game is full of open targets. Plus, its the primary reason Alpine Assault, although it is a small map, leads the 1v1 maps in imbalances against China. Any later-game terror car strategy can be easily countered.

Won't happen. This is an unofficial patch, so EA won't use it.

GR.org's goal is to make the Community Balance Patch official, in a similar way to the way v1.03 was created. EA is aware of the developments of the community balance patch. It took a lot of nerfing, but the balance has become nearly perfect. (of course, inf < all the glas < toxin is unfixable without severe modding)

In my honest opinion, the patch has been perfected. If only we had the colossal lamer community backing it with us.

[SgtRicko]

Well, I still hate the patch. It nerfed the hell out of Granger, (which I considered to be a newb's "Crutch Race," at least until they got the ideas of some things) and nerfed Toxin even more, which I considered to be UP, especially against armored units or MDvees.

[Derek]

Well, I still hate the patch. It nerfed the hell out of Granger, (which I considered to be a newb's "Crutch Race," at least until they got the ideas of some things) and nerfed Toxin even more, which I considered to be UP, especially against armored units or MDvees.
AF gen was severely OP, and there is no need for a "Crutch race". Tox was also OP and was nerfed because of it, but not as much as AF gen was nerfed.

[Daishi]

All the USAs were crutch races since Generals came out. And they still are. xD

Besides, whether or not USAF has been perfectly balanced with the USAs and GLAs (which you fail to understand is a good thing) it is still the best teammate you could ask for, true in every official multiplayer map. :)

[SgtRicko]

Thing is, USAF's KRs were special that way, having superior point defenses: now, they're nearly crap against anything with AA capabilities, and EMP Pats pretty much can pwn them now.

[Daishi]

That's why you work your way around and blow up their dozers and power plants first. Or, if you're smart enough to start the match with an MD drop and some vees, start with an MD drop and some vees. You still can fly some serious nooks or KRs over the battle (without attacking) and give your own vees an advantage. I don't need to list the advantages you still get to have, especially when you've only got the SWG strategy center (do targets get much easier for your forces?) as a devastating advantage. The thing is that now SWG can use a more normal BO to deal with a USAF matchup. USAF now has to work for his wins against SWG, that's it.

Oh, and did I mention you had to hit King Raptors twice in a row with the EMP Patriot to make them successfully go down? :p (undocumented feature)

[drgNz~]

and EMP Pats pretty much can pwn them now.

Because it was oh-so-great when SW had absolutely no chance against USAF except for heavy drops >_>"

[Daishi]

SgtRicko, drgNz, want to try it out next weekend? Everyone else with the patch is ridiculously pr0.

[Derek]

SgtRicko, drgNz, want to try it out next weekend? Everyone else with the patch is ridiculously pr0.
Dude, if you guys are testing out 1.05c then count me in!

[SgtRicko]

Dude, if you guys are testing out 1.05c then count me in!

You got it, bud!!!:cool:

Thing is though, can we do this next week? This week has me doing a lot of projects and crap for college, so I'd probably wouldn't be able to make it for this weekend.:\

[drgNz~]

I'm up for it, although I've got soccer on Saturday. I'm sure we can work something out, just msn me Daisha :)

[Zancloufer27]

SgtRicko, drgNz, want to try it out next weekend? Everyone else with the patch is ridiculously pr0.
So you don't want to test it with me? drgNz~ is better than me, unless the map isn't TD :p

[drgNz~]

So you don't want to test it with me? drgNz~ is better than me, unless the map isn't TD :p

I'm sorry for being crap at horribly unbalanced maps ;p

[Zancloufer27]

It was a mirror, and the map was symentrical, so thats no excuse :p

[Daishi]

So you don't want to test it with me? drgNz~ is better than me, unless the map isn't TD :p

Dude, if you guys are testing out 1.05c then count me in!

Whoa, I left some dudes out.

K then, I'm available Friday and Saturday. ^^

/me points out to drgNz that there's no excuse to suck at imbalanced maps ~ all you have to do is exploit the imbalance. :p

[Derek]

Drgnz is definately better than Zan, sorry. I've had some close games with Drgnz, he is really quite good, but against me he usually makes a critical mistake that costs him the game (not tunneling the middle, not protecting the flanks, I'm sure you remember drgnz ;) ). Zan definately knows what he is doing, but has never managed to hold me off for very long.

[Daishi]

I'm definitely the worst player among us, except Ricko, I'm yet to see him in action.

[Zancloufer27]

Weell Derek, can YOU play off TD? ;) You haven't played me in a while though, would be nice to have a game vs someone good.

[drgNz~]

TD 4 lyf~!

[Daishi]

Weell Derek, can YOU play off TD? ;) You haven't played me in a while though, would be nice to have a game vs someone good.

I'm hurt. :(

:p

[Zancloufer27]

As in good, better than me ;)

[Daishi]

Without a second thought I decided to join a 1.04 tourney, so I'll be a little late on Friday. Anyone else who wants to join in the meantime, its frontpaged right here. (http://www.gamereplays.org/cncreplays/portal.htm)

[yurihomer]

zan i will play vs u in any 2 players map u want.

[C4]

Hurrahh!!!! At last!:hyper: :hyper: :hyper: :hyper: :hyper:

Well, i just knew about it, and so i haven't read all the changes yet. That one about the terrorcar is a bit too much. It turns them useless really.
But first let's see exactly what was changed.
About it being official, there's a chance of getting it there, so have faith.

And i feel very happy to see many of u entusiastic about it and ready to rock. It was about a new tourny, what u' were talking about? :chin:
If only i could play online...:(
I'm sure Derek can be (once more) a perfect moderator.

Anyway, it a celebration day to all of us (maybe excepto Ricko and his love for Granger's planes:D ).

[Daishi]

Hurrahh!!!! At last!:hyper: :hyper: :hyper: :hyper: :hyper:

Well, i just knew about it, and so i haven't read all the changes yet. That one about the terrorcar is a bit too much. It turns them useless really.
But first let's see exactly what was changed.
About it being official, there's a chance of getting it there, so have faith.

And i feel very happy to see many of u entusiastic about it and ready to rock. It was about a new tourny, what u' were talking about? :chin:
If only i could play online...:(
I'm sure Derek can be (once more) a perfect moderator.

Anyway, it a celebration day to all of us (maybe excepto Ricko and his love for Granger's planes:D ).

Yeah, it's great. In essence it's just 1.05b sans OP cars and taking back a few unnecessary changes in past patches. And fixing the most famous bug in RTS history. :D:D:D

In this last development, China might even stand a chance in the weird maps.

[C4]

And fixing the most famous bug in RTS history. :D:D:D


Bug?!!! What bug was that?:chin: They the community usually don't correct bugs, just fix balance problems!:rolleyes:

[Daishi]

Well they fixed the scud bug. This was done as a bonus to push EA to incorporate it.

[SgtRicko]

Well they fixed the scud bug. This was done as a bonus to push EA to incorporate it.

Here's to hoping they don't.:hmm:

[drgNz~]

It would kill off all the noobs ;D

Oh, and we're still testing it tonight, right?

[SgtRicko]

It would kill off all the noobs ;D

Oh, and we're still testing it tonight, right?

Without n00bs, where would you get new players?

[drgNz~]

Noobs, not newbs. And hopefully the patch will drive away all the noobs, simply because they probably won't be able to live without their super-powerful rocketmenz or their lameveez.

See, this is the way I like to think of it;
When the newbs start the game, they get into the lobby and see a bunch of game-names like "Mr_hahn666" or "blindsidE-". They join the game, only to get their asses handed to them. They go back to the lobby, to look for an easier opponent, seeing as no-one likes losing. Oh, looky, there's a nice norush 15 game where I can build lots and lots of defences! /join game.
And that, imo, is how noobs reproduce.

Now, if you get rid of the noobs, when the newbs start the game, they get their ass handed to them, but instead of taking the easy option of the horrible norush/noSW/rules, they'll keep joining the proper games and eventually get better.

That's my theory anyway, created out of pure boredom >_>

[SgtRicko]

Not everyone is bound to take that route, you know. If you make a community too unfriendly to newcomers, you can end up hurting the community in the long run.

The Splinter Cell online Community is a pretty good example. Until Double Agent decided to change some stuff around, it was near impossible for a newcomer to survive on the online world due to all of the aggressive players and steep learning curves, which eventually caused the online community to stop growing for quite some time.

[drgNz~]

Well, of course not everyone will choose that path. Some will just give up, but the ones who are actually willing to learn and understand the importance of balance will [hopefully] increase the small population of "competative players" you find online.

[SgtRicko]

The StarCraft Community has an absolutely large number of n00bs, yet it's still one of the most competitive and 133t RTS games out there!

[drgNz~]

Probably because along with the noobs, there's 3469873896738967 other players; more than you can say for Zero Hour :s

[Daishi]

Truthfully, Zero Hour 1.05 doesn't really hurt bunker games in the least. It even works towards balancing them. (though admittedly not too much).

How is 1.05 not noob-friendly anyway? :| There's less vee laming and less hopeless China situations, surely that won't kill the spirit of the noob: all the basic strategies still remain.

[drgNz~]

How is 1.05 not noob-friendly anyway? :| There's less vee laming and less hopeless China situations, surely that won't kill the spirit of the noob: all the basic strategies still remain.

You answered your own question. The noobs actually have to think outside the box now, and can't win game after game doing the same thing :/

And I also never said that the patch would actually effect bunker games, but moreso effect the noobs that can't play without toxin rockets than do 1000000 damage.

[Daishi]

I don't think it makes much of a difference. Someone's going to enter these games with proper strategy and everyone present will learn that they can still win easily with a bazillion toxin tunnels/Stingers/BMs. No rush and pro rules become less lame as people start winning without toxin. (all I know is the three games I played I beat em with toxin, becausde either setup leaves tox overpowered unless the lamers go scudbuggin'. Which is all too often in those matches.)

While we're on this topic, isn't it sad that I can play no rush 15 3v3 three times and get tunnel rushed every single game and when I attack the tunnel the noob says "NO RUSH FAG" These people were born inadequate. :|

[yurihomer]

Noobs, not newbs. And hopefully the patch will drive away all the noobs, simply because they probably won't be able to live without their super-powerful rocketmenz or their lameveez.

See, this is the way I like to think of it;
When the newbs start the game, they get into the lobby and see a bunch of game-names like "Mr_hahn666" or "blindsidE-". They join the game, only to get their asses handed to them. They go back to the lobby, to look for an easier opponent, seeing as no-one likes losing. Oh, looky, there's a nice norush 15 game where I can build lots and lots of defences! /join game.
And that, imo, is how noobs reproduce.

Now, if you get rid of the noobs, when the newbs start the game, they get their ass handed to them, but instead of taking the easy option of the horrible norush/noSW/rules, they'll keep joining the proper games and eventually get better.

That's my theory anyway, created out of pure boredom >_>

true, thats how i learned anyway

[C4]

Not everyone is bound to take that route, you know. If you make a community too unfriendly to newcomers, you can end up hurting the community in the long run.

The Splinter Cell online Community is a pretty good example. Until Double Agent decided to change some stuff around, it was near impossible for a newcomer to survive on the online world due to all of the aggressive players and steep learning curves, which eventually caused the online community to stop growing for quite some time.

DrgNz and Daishi already answered to u, but i'm yet about to understand where bug-fixing and balance hurts the community or make a "community unfriendly to newcomers". In fact, would u like to lose all the games to a noob who always exploits the same bug or imbalance even if u can see clearly he's using bad stategy? :wtf:
I'm sure this would hurt more seriously the community by scaring away potential good players. Sorry but those scared by balance shouldn't even play this game. There are plenty of "deliciously imbalanced" games around, enough to everybody. ;)

Note: i've never knew what scud-bug was and i'm already happy about its fixing. :D

[drgNz~]

I'm sure you've asked before, but for the record;

The Scud-Bug is an exploit in which players can launch numerous Scud-Storms within seconds, without the timer being down to zero.
I've read that it's only possible before the Scud-Storm has finished construction, but the numerous times it's been used against me [I admit, I bash too many noobs] the Scud-Storm has been completed.

[C4]

I'm sure you've asked before, but for the record;

The Scud-Bug is an exploit in which players can launch numerous Scud-Storms within seconds, without the timer being down to zero.
I've read that it's only possible before the Scud-Storm has finished construction, but the numerous times it's been used against me [I admit, I bash too many noobs] the Scud-Storm has been completed.

Ok, u're sure i've asked before, 'cause i did! (Probably was u who answered me by that time):D
What i meant was, i've never seen that happening. This "know" i've used meant "meet personally".:D
Thx anyway!

They should have worked hard to fix that bug. It surely required code programming, not just .ini manipulation. I've already congratulated them properly on www.gamereplays.org (http://www.gamereplays.org). Now let's benefict of that (even if, as i said, i've never been a victim of such.).:)

[Daishi]

I've read that it's only possible before the Scud-Storm has finished construction

Unfinished building bug has been fixed in an earlier patch.